Related
I have been reading through alot of posts here over the last couple weeks.
There seems to be a lot of bickering, pointless debate, insults and flaming going on here. (I know am probably starting more with this post, but that is why I chose the off-topic forum) I know you get it on all internet forums, but this one seems to be worse than most.
I actually had someone pm me on something recently, I believe, because he was too afraid to make a post asking for help. I dont blame him. If someone here asks a question that may or may not have been asked months ago (therefore buried by 10 pages of more current posts) he gets flamed. I also notice he asks another newbie like me, instead of someone with a lot of posts, because they seem to be the most touchy.
And I know, that is why there is a search. But you know, search tools on forums like this are a joke. You are going to get a return of 1000's of posts, 99% of which have nothing to do with what you are looking for. And for me at least, half the time when I search, and I am rewarded with a blank page (in both mozilla and IE).
Just wanted report on what I see here. Maybe others see it differently.
Jimmy - not to validate your argument, but I disagree with you!
Seriously, I respond to so many posts, probably even unnecessarily so sometimes, just because I like the community. The vast majority of us are here because we enjoy the community and are like-minded gadget freaks.
You do get some flaming, some *****ing, some idiots, some spam, some divas. But the vast majority, in my experience, are very nice, helpful and supportive of newbies. We were all one once, and I hope that I'd rather say nothing then something unhelpful.
Anyone can PM or email me any time. I can't respond immediately, but I will try to respond.
The usual "use the search, Luke", response is normally only fired out when you've got a very new member blurting out things like "How do I switch the phone off?". My reasoning there is, teach a man to fish, he'll help himself a lot more then just filling his gullet with answers. But, for valid, non knee jerk questions, most people will try to help.
I think it's better no one answers if they don't know, and if they don't, feel free to bump. But don't bump twice in 5 mins - "COME ON, DOESN'T ANYBODY
KNOW HOW TO SORT MY CONTACTS BY FIRST NAME??!?!?!??!" is not a way to make friends with me.
Anyway, I could rant all day, but I think the board generally speaks for itself. Most are helpful, most are nice, most are here because we want to be here.
You get some bad posts, but seriously, in my year on the board, I've only had two encounters that caused me to contemplate leaving...
V
PS this was an interesting thread:
http://forum.xda-developers.com/viewtopic.php?p=329718#329718
I know it is not everyone, my subject should not have been why are people so temperamental, it should have been why are SOME people so temperamental.
I agree with you, if it is a repetive question, just dont answer. I just think it is bad when people are pm'ing rather than posting because they are afraid.
vijay555 said:
You get some bad posts, but seriously, in my year on the board, I've only had two encounters that caused me to contemplate leaving...
V
PS this was an interesting thread:
http://forum.xda-developers.com/viewtopic.php?p=329718#329718
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I gotta' agree with you on that thread, vijay. Those pics (the original ones) NEVER should have been posted. They provoked a LOT of ire from users and flaming, too. There's no room for politics on this forum. It's not here for that purpose and I felt like that was where that thread was heading. Even the world news networks don't show images THAT graphic!! Thanks for deleting them and putting that thread back "on course".
whos temperamental, you [email protected]@rd!
STFU! you think your so [email protected] smart, coming here and reading entries and you probably dont know your @ss froma hole in the ground when it comes to pdas....
whos says people here are temperamental?
dont know your @ss froma hole in the ground
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Gosh, in countries where you actually poo straight into a hole in the ground, this might cause some rather embarrassing situations!
V
maybe i hang out in the wrong forums or my level of what is hostile is wayy different from yours
but this is one of the most friendly forums i come in
or have ever come in (and thats a great deal)
i dont see telling people to use search and the likes to be hostile
personal attacks is hostile
Dont know what the problem is, sure once in a while people get pointed to search, wiki or spend some time reading. And yes once in awhile there are no flowers in that reply.
Sure even I have had the balls to move a post out of news and tell the guy to post in the correct, forum, read wiki and use search. It pisses of our other users who think news is news and not news being somebody asking how do I upgrade my device.
I have seen a lot of threads, a few things I did not like to see, a few I have killed. I have seen nice, not so nice and far form nice askers and also answerres.
In general you get a lot more help here than on other places (yes I have had to look other places).
But hell its a free word, if anybody thinks this site is not good to or for them, well its a click of the mouse to solve that problem.
Mean while will I point a user to the answer of his question which in fact is the same question in 4 different sections. Hum let me think about that one.
Personally I find most people on the forum very friendly. You always get a few who are a bit temperamental but that is life. But on the whole this would have to be the most helpful and friendly forum around.
I will have to agree and disagree with this.. i havent been a member that long and i did take the smart route, i actually read this board over and from top to bottom for months before making a single post, what stopped me from making a post right away was most senior people's complaints about newbs not searching, etc.. so i did just that searched and read... and here i am 3 months later of my first post and have made well over 500 now.. (i have point to all of this somewhere here ) This site can be a little confusing to newbs, but most of the confusion comes from other newbs making the same posts over and over again, you might search for one thing and come up with 50 posts of the same problem, however 49 of them are flames telling them to search to find the answer... and this is where it also gets frustrating for the senior people, people who have already answered this once before causing the temperamental flames.. Now i do try to answer what i can, we were all newbs once and i still consider myself one and i answer many pm's of people who are afraid to be flamed (which if they would have searched they would have found the answer) but im also not their personal wiki... ok, im done, oh yeah, vote for me for president
I agree with jimmy hauser
I came here from treocentral, which was much more supportive on average. Sure, there are some good-spirited and helpful people here, but it is overall much more antagonistic than treocentral.
As a practical matter, the search engine isn't very good and the recent upgrade of the forum didn't make it easier. It took me a few weeks to think of googling with the site:xda-developers.com, identifying the appropriate thread and then searching for that specific threads. Otherwise, one gets too much. Yes, we all find it annoying when someone starts a new thread that has already been answered fifty times, but on the other hand, there are pretty many 20+ page threads. It might be helpful to suggest to someone what they should have searched for, and try the search to see if it works. Just today I was trying to find the registry tweak that would eliminate the roaming indicator, but I couldn't remember what the thing did, so it took forever to find the registry tweak, and this for something I knew I had read on the board at some point in the past.
Here is what I think is actually better than most sites: the wiki. The wikis are uniformly high quality and some people have written fabulous how-tos.
My pet theory is that it is windows at fault. Things like activesync being so hilariously dysfunctional and the X meaning minimize on the PPC cause tempers to rise just a little too easily. Palm users are happier.
On the other hand, without XDA-developers, my MDA would have been approximately useless. The list of problems that were answered, either directly or indirectly, here is huge. Everything from ROM upgrades to TodayAgenda to 2.47 radio rom to wifi settings to wm5newmenu, I got them here. It is a wonderful resource.
I came here from esato, former sony ericsson user ditched it with the p990
if you really want to get flamed say I didn't like the p990 on esato or god forbid the tytn is better than it (I had both got rid of the p990) basically compare anything or say anything is better than a S.E. phone and you'll get your diehard fanboys by the dozens.
anyways some people get flamed here beacuse they are total noobs who don't bother to read anything, I agree they shouldn't get flamed that bad but they should do a little reading, there is a wealth of information in these forums,
as for asking I try to reply to anyone who asks something I know and if anybody needs anything please feel free to pm me I will answer when I can, although posting a forum gives more views as well as future reference for future noobs
I think this site provides so much useful information and it has kept many devices going when they would have gone in the bin. It has allowed a lot of older devices to still have the current operating system. I think half the time people have got home from work and are on a short fuse any way and any little thing pushes them over the edge and that is what causes the bickering. Just my thoughts on the matter.
darky said:
anyways some people get flamed here beacuse they are total noobs who don't bother to read anything, I agree they shouldn't get flamed that bad but they should do a little reading, there is a wealth of information in these forums,
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I'm not sure if I'm the "temperamental" one here, but yes, that is a very annoying thing. They act as if the members here are google, and they just type in a search sentence "Nood here, please give me a clear, step-by-step, easy to flash my ROM", click a button, and you get the answer. Not to mentioned the lack of information they provide, which can be potentially harmful to them consider they don't even know which ROM to get. And when things go wrong, they will post a new thread with the title "Pleeeeaazzz help".
The another annoying thing is the lack of information. Some members will post problems with so little information that they delay the solution to their very own questions, and annoying for the helpers. Eg. "I downloaded the flash software and ROM, but now the phone won't start, please help". Then, you try to be helpful and suggest "Why don't you try program X?". Later, you will get the answer "Oh, I've already tried that, won't work. Any other suggestion?" .. I will be like.. why don't you said so in your first post? ggrrrr..
Anyway, now I've developed an habbit of ignoring such posts. Those (a) Step by step guide for total nood (b) Thread with Pleeazzz help title (c) Post with lack of information. This will make me.. less "temperamental", I guess.
Anyway, as for the Wiki, I still thinks there are not enough information in the Wiki, such that it makes members difficult to point noobs to simple/common tasks. And, it also makes the non-noobs (the oldies ) going around the search function to answer something that they've forgot. So, for those who are happy to help others, please contribute yourself to the Wiki. Personally, I think it is much more influential to get one thing onto the Wiki than answering 10 PMs. And you get to point them to the Wiki if the same problem surfaced.
I'm temperamental beware
Well I remember when I got my MDAIII back over a year ago and came across this site thanks to google. So like a noob that I was and in many areas still our I posted one of those "how do I upgrade my german MDAIII to English.
Well I can tell you what has changed over the last year. Back then I got NO ANSWER, no falming, no use search, no use wiki.
So over time this site has changed and now at least you can get a reply even if this is thought by many as beeing flamed at.
Over time I learnt 2 things, one to read and one to use search. The reading I have kept the Search well that is a Pain in the ass. In the blue angel section (upgrade) do a search for "new rom" and you get Zero, its a bug we are working on it but it still sucks. Now in the same BA Upgrade section do a search for Threads by "MDAIIIUser". Here you get "New Rom" "new rom:" "New rom!" and the like.
Myself I have stoped the use search as I cant use it myself in the form that I want. Sad but true.
So what is the solutiom, for me it was then wiki, sure I had to post on how to edit it but with time I could even work it out. So from there I found out how to upgrade and posted it on wiki, found roms and posted them, found an unlocker, cabs and a bunch of stuff that I thought was cool of intrest and useful. So I posted it in wiki, edited it when new roms came out, ect bla bal.
Well Time moved on and I got bored after the 3 WM5 rom and well nothing else happens in the BA section the device is dead only sold by a few and thus.... I left it.
Now there is lots of grest info here, lots of great people that have found out lots of cool tricks. Its what makes this site, not the how do I upgrade or should I perform a restore after a rom upgrade. However noobs, newbies what ever we might like to discredit them as have a right to be here, I riight to the information and a right to some constructive help.
What we should all do is keep wiki upto date which is a lot easiser for a new member as he is driven by the quest of knowlege than an old member that does nto realy care in which direction his rom goes to as there is nothing new.
So I am not going to search the wiki pages for who finds this sites attitude bad but himslef has failed to update wiki, nor try to work out which users are helpful or flame.
All I am trying to say and now we get to the short version, is be nice, remember that you to were lost on this site and Please update wiki.
Oh yes, you will find a posts from me that just read "moved to XX (BA, Universal, hermes) but you will also see my signature which should point some people in the correct direction. Could I have answered all of there questions, yes sometims, sometimes not. So why don't I? well that due to the fact that some of us try to keep the site clean.
personally i feel the same way as the orginal poster...but i do see where some of yall are coming from with n00bs askin the same ? thats been answered before. i currently run a forum and have that problem sometimes. im no complete n00b just a novice with all this hackin/developin and i noticed i postd some ?s months ago with no responses at all and yes i searched for the answer and vj u had even posted in that thread but i never got a response. i didnt get mad....i pmd someone who helped me out the best he could since he was as new as me. i have found pm to be the best method of recieving help on this board....even tho at times "anal retentive" members dont even respond to say anything....no "f off" no "yea sure do this..." no "try looking here" just no response at all leaving n00bs to think i better not post if i dont know fully what im talking about.....i personally think the community would be better if everyone treated everyone as they would like to have been treated wheb they were n00bs. we all were at one point and time......shezzzzz......dont u guys remember? well all this is imho.
~mike
this does not apply to newbie's only.
i have asked about five times for help in here, responses 2
so i have been forced to read ,sometimes i find the answer some times
not.
pm several user for help. reply; 1
i receive several pms asking for help every week, i try to help ,but some people never give up. suddenly u become their personal google.
i got a guy now asking to write a a full tutorial in how to cook a rom. yea right!!
like an don’t have anything to do.
so I email him and said I was very busy at the moment, I would try to help when I had time.
following day got word from him. have you got time yet? !!!! now I get an email from him everyday. he says hi is in a hurry!!!!
faria
Love your newbie read this!
faria said:
I email him and said I was very busy at the moment, I would try to help when I had time.
following day got word from him. have you got time yet? !!!! now I get an email from him everyday. he says hi is in a hurry!!!!
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rofl
here is a good example of why people get temperamental
http://forum.xda-developers.com/showthread.php?p=1038017&posted=1#post1038017
Okay, this post is really intended as a comment and I am not going to pretend I have THE answer but I do have some suggestions to spark discussion.
Based on a lot of the recent comments and back and forth about newbies/tech support I think that the forum is trending the same way I have seen MANY other forums go. What happens is simple; a group of first adopters, who are by default, technically capable, get together on a forum and start to fill in the gaps in tech support, especially when it comes to 'modded' soft or hardwre. They spend a while helping each other out and a comfort level develops. Members know where to go, and when to ask questions.
Then what happens is that the hardware becomes much more popular. All of a sudden your average Joe can walk out a Cingular store with a 8125 for a couple hundred bucks. These folks are NOT early adopters. They are not necessarily tech savvy. They are the people that are most prone to 'keyboard to chair interface errors'. Since the early members did such a good job raising the profile of the forum it starts to come up every time someone does a Google search. and they all end up over their heads.
So then the folks that have been around for a while start to get frustrated. Why should they provide tech support? Why can't these newbies read? Why should they even try to help if they get barraged by stupid questions?
Well I think that takes us to where we are now, so the question is what do we do now? In my experience the only solution that I have seen is to have people equally dedicated to wiki and sticky writing as they are to writing ROMs and programs. The truth is that if you release something you WILL become tech support and a large part of tech support is writing documentation and then explaining it to others.
I have intended this post as something helpful and to spark discussion, not as a criticism of anyone in particular or any particular group. Hopefully it will be taken as such
I agree. I get the feeling that since the relaunch, for one reason or another, there appears to be a lot more"Why don't my apps close when I press X?" and "How dat I swtich this thing 0ff!!!!!!!" type posts.
I think that it's beholden on more experienced users to try to share their experience as they see fit, but it's absolutely essential that newbs and less experienced users use the search button and wiki.
I've been sponsoring a post in the moderators' forum regarding having a specific section for Tutorials etc, eg for the excellent posts that Menneisyys puts together. The wiki may not be the best place for them (due to the risk of negative edits), although it's certainly better then people never looking at them at all...
But as you say, it's pretty much predicted by psychohistory that all fora of dedicated people will eventually turn into a tech support. I don't mind, but less experienced must use the resources already online - quid pro quo.
V
As a new user on this forum i have noticed inconsitant information about G3 vs G4 devices and ROM upgrading. I've seen questions asked by people about G4 devices that go unanswered.
I think the problem with searching on this forum and many others. They do not allow you to search for 3 or fewer letter acronyms such as IPL, SPL, CID. There is no way to search for answers about these things. If there is a setting on the forum that can be changed to allow searching for these terms, then please fix it.
I think when people start posting info about how they did something they need to specify what hardware they are using G3/G4. Thankfully i havent done anything as far as modding my device, but i had seen posts where someone most likely with a G3 device says they figured out how to do this or that, Then someone with a G4 comes along and tried it, not knowing it was done on a G3 and ended up screwing up their device. We need to clearly specify what hardware we are doing mods on.
I still have no clear answer about CID unlocking a G4. I know there is no free utility to do it. Ive seen posts that say the imei-check site can CID unlock. Then i saw a post this morning that imei-check is only a SIM unlock. Can people please provide clear info?
d0ug said:
As a new user on this forum i have noticed inconsitant information about G3 vs G4 devices and ROM upgrading. I've seen questions asked by people about G4 devices that go unanswered.
I think the problem with searching on this forum and many others. They do not allow you to search for 3 or fewer letter acronyms such as IPL, SPL, CID. There is no way to search for answers about these things. If there is a setting on the forum that can be changed to allow searching for these terms, then please fix it.
I think when people start posting info about how they did something they need to specify what hardware they are using G3/G4. Thankfully i havent done anything as far as modding my device, but i had seen posts where someone most likely with a G3 device says they figured out how to do this or that, Then someone with a G4 comes along and tried it, not knowing it was done on a G3 and ended up screwing up their device. We need to clearly specify what hardware we are doing mods on.
I still have no clear answer about CID unlocking a G4. I know there is no free utility to do it. Ive seen posts that say the imei-check site can CID unlock. Then i saw a post this morning that imei-check is only a SIM unlock. Can people please provide clear info?
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I agree with you d0ug! It is rather confusing to navigate and find your way. Especially when you are a n00b, such as myself. I have been trying to mod my phone for 3 days now. I have tried many ways of unlocking my G3, but none of them have worked. I have listened to 3 different people tell me their "way" of unlocking the phone, and all 3 attempts failed in the end. I get flamed for not reading posts or searching, when i did, just nothing relevant popped up! This is not a whine fest, just saying that some people dont have phones that were built on a Wednesday, like mine that was probably built on a Monday and has issues!
Either way, i called Cingular and they are shipping me a brand new 8125 to test things out on!
Canon
Haven't been a wizard user that long although I've been in the ppc scene in about 5 years and quite active in several forums. The most successful solution that I've seen to this problem (witch enevitably always comes up) is to not let new users post for at least 7 days and/or forcing them to read various informational topics before getting access to the actual forum.
This will of course not get everyone but has in my experience improved the situation considerably.
Ah well, that's just my two cents
vijay555 said:
I agree. I get the feeling that since the relaunch, for one reason or another, there appears to be a lot more"Why don't my apps close when I press X?" and "How dat I swtich this thing 0ff!!!!!!!" type posts.
I think that it's beholden on more experienced users to try to share their experience as they see fit, but it's absolutely essential that newbs and less experienced users use the search button and wiki.
I've been sponsoring a post in the moderators' forum regarding having a specific section for Tutorials etc, eg for the excellent posts that Menneisyys puts together. The wiki may not be the best place for them (due to the risk of negative edits), although it's certainly better then people never looking at them at all...
But as you say, it's pretty much predicted by psychohistory that all fora of dedicated people will eventually turn into a tech support. I don't mind, but less experienced must use the resources already online - quid pro quo.
V
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Vijay, very happy to see that the mods are looking at this. I agree that Wiki's have their limitations especially given the validity of some of the comments about conflicting advice.
The search function definitely does have its limits as well, and people are less likely to go through searches that produce a 100 threads with 5 pages each.
I for one would feel a lot better about telling someone harshly to stop answering questions if I knew that I could also direct them to a single place for answers.
I really love this forum and it has helped me so much. I don't post much except to say "thank you" from time to time to the people who have made some program that has been helpful to me. And although I have been coming to this board every day for over a year I still don't know half as much as the majority of people here.
Some solutions to this problem are:
1) get frustrated and write a mean message to the noob
2) take a minute and just give the link to the page where the answer is
3) make it easier on this forum to find things
_Nomad_ said:
Haven't been a wizard user that long although I've been in the ppc scene in about 5 years and quite active in several forums. The most successful solution that I've seen to this problem (witch enevitably always comes up) is to not let new users post for at least 7 days and/or forcing them to read various informational topics before getting access to the actual forum.
This will of course not get everyone but has in my experience improved the situation considerably.
Ah well, that's just my two cents
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That could be nice... part of the things that had contributed to the bad search results are the tons of new threads asking the very same questions over and over and over again... is there anyway to disable these threads from showing up in the search results? Maybe it's time for us to out up another sticky thread specifically talking abóut G4 devices =)
vseehua said:
That could be nice... part of the things that had contributed to the bad search results are the tons of new threads asking the very same questions over and over and over again... is there anyway to disable these threads from showing up in the search results? Maybe it's time for us to out up another sticky thread specifically talking abóut G4 devices =)
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I would like to see a thread dedicated to G4 devices, with verified correct information in it.
It isnt just people asking the same questions over and over making the search junk. Its the inability to even search for simple short 3 letter acronyms like CID, IPL, SPL, AKU. These are all things I have tried to search for and get 0 results. If I were able to search for these terms I could probably turn up a wealth of information on my own.
_Nomad_ said:
Haven't been a wizard user that long although I've been in the ppc scene in about 5 years and quite active in several forums. The most successful solution that I've seen to this problem (witch enevitably always comes up) is to not let new users post for at least 7 days and/or forcing them to read various informational topics before getting access to the actual forum.
This will of course not get everyone but has in my experience improved the situation considerably.
Ah well, that's just my two cents
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That would work me thinks!!!!!
Hi all,
I've been reading this forum for weeks now and still have not found enough answers to be secure enough and cid-unlock my G3 2.21 vario.
I HAVE indeed read most relevant threads, although navigating them can be somewhat confusing. However When I posted some -in my n00b opinion - valid questions I either got 1) no reply whatsoever 2) replies to read "the" threads....which wasn't really helpfull or I wouldn't have asked 3) contradicting advice .... like a 2.21 G3 Can be unlocked, or it Cannot be unlocked, you have to downgrade twice, you have to upgrade twice, you Can or Cannot flash a G4 rom to a G3 device so you won't have to downgrade and CID unlock your phone first, etc.
I believe that I am somewhat beyond the real n00b level right now but still I'd like information to be more consistent and easier to find, I've already tried to suggest making a stickied n00b FAQ or wiki for us where to find the basic answers in a easy and consistent manner so the sdame questions aren't asked over and over and ROM threads hijacked for support questions.
but that is just my cup of tea.
thanks for a good forum with vlauable info.
stefan.
Regular search
Personally, I find using google or yahoo, with site:xda-developers.com, works much better than the forum search. My personal pet peeve is the inability to use quotes to search for phrases. Quotes don't work.
A major problem with "read the threads" is the 800+ entry length of some of them. It would be nice to try to harness the power of those of us newly figuring things out and ask them to submit a wiki for something they just learned. If we had a submission point for the wiki, perhaps those of us who recently learned new things would do a how-to write-up and submit it to the wiki.
Finally, there are a lot of repeat threads, many with false or useless information. These threads stand in the way of a searcher. I would be happier if the moderators deleted more bad threads. Alternatively, we could use democracy -- add a "vote to delete" button to every thread not posted by a moderator and if a high enough percentage vote to delete, the thread is gone. I'd suggest 20% as a threshold -- more than that and the thread goes away.
Have been reading all your comments and completely agree with you guys... I see you have specific problems on G3/G4 on Wizards, as someone suggested a separate subforum for G4 devices would be ideal for you, and also for Prophet I guess.
About the search functions I'm also using google to search as a fallback when I can't find specific things using vBulletin's integrated search function, there's a thread on the mod forum where we discussed how to improve it, but seems is not very active now... will try to push Flar to do something about that.
Regarding the wiki, I think everyone should be less afraid to edit, if you look at the "recent changes" you see always the same people is editing. Have a look at the Hermes or BlueAngel wiki pages, these are good examples on how info has to be organized on the wiki, it's easy to find everything on the front page and information is well divided. Formating may seem a bit complicated at the beginning, but you don't have to care too much if you just want to add content, sure someone more experienced with wiki syntax will edit and correct any bad formating mistakes.
I do 100% agree with you that the wiki itself doesn't cover half of what it should. Yet if you take the time to read through it, and the links, you should be quite familiar with your device...
And oh yeah, sure, you can't search for keywords less than four characters, but that's not really an excuse... look at the thread containing the latest Faria ROM. Half... Half of what the thread contains is the same question over and over again... those ppl didn't even read the initial post of the thread... they found the download link, tried to install the ROM, got problem and went right to work, posting their (stupid) question all over again and again... The problem was never the limited search capabilities... It's always the ppl...
A board without limitations always get bloated with crap, whether it's unwanted commercial och just plain stupid posts...
So, unfortunatly this is going to continue unless you put constraints on the board... I'm sorry, but that's what's gonna happen.
Seems to me that since this was posted the situation has sorta escalated... Faria, Molski, risidoro and just now Dr P has announced their leave.
In this rate all that'll be left will be the newbies soon. Sad to witness
_Nomad_ said:
And oh yeah, sure, you can't search for keywords less than four characters, but that's not really an excuse... look at the thread containing the latest Faria ROM. Half... Half of what the thread contains is the same question over and over again... those ppl didn't even read the initial post of the thread... they found the download link, tried to install the ROM, got problem and went right to work, posting their (stupid) question all over again and again... The problem was never the limited search capabilities... It's always the ppl...
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It's also very human.
_Nomad_ said:
A board without limitations always get bloated with crap, whether it's unwanted commercial och just plain stupid posts...
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There just should be enough moderators. Now what happens when you write something stupid is you also get useless answers like "don't do that" which just makes everything even worse. There should be a "FAQ"-section, there should be a "how-to"-section etc...but there isn't. The forum structure is FAR TOO SIMPLE to handle the amount of messages.
Two main things to handle this (just my opinion):
Re-designed forum structure
Moderators
(well, the structure should be designed in the first place so that it would be easy to extend it later...not an easy job)
prestonmcafee said:
...A major problem with "read the threads" is the 800+ entry length of some of them. It would be nice to try to harness the power of those of us newly figuring things out...
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I usually suggest to those asking questions to post the solution to their question in the first post. But I'm over at the Mio forums, and since we only have 4500 peps, the mods aren't overwhelmed. I can lock a thread, post the correct thread to post in, and a few days later, delete the thread. I spend 1/2 my time using the search function to consolidate questions into single threads. But like I said, that's not feasible here. I suggest a PM sent to everyone the registers, that is kind of a quick start guide. I understand why the 3 letter limit, because people type words like "the" and "and". I'm not sure how powerful the forum software is, but it would be nice to remove the size limit, and omit such words as mentioned above, from the search.
Regards,
Jason
mlehtola said:
There should be a "FAQ"-section, there should be a "how-to"-section etc...but there isn't. The forum structure is FAR TOO SIMPLE to handle the amount of messages.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Ummm, have you ever taken the time to look at the Wiki?
This forum is being provided to us basically for free. (Except for voluntary donations.) I personally can't afford to donate $$$ to the community, or for that matter to individual developers, so I dedicate some time to post in the forums to share what I've learned. I have also donated time to updating the Wiki.
If the Wiki doesn't contain all you would like it to, just add it yourself! One brief tutorial could make a world of difference to a newbie, or even a more experienced user. It also helps to point out gaps in the general knowledge we have here in these forums.
If, for example, there isn't a sub-forum for the device you use, you don't have to wait for the moderators, etc. to create it. Just create a Wiki page, and get the ball rolling on your own!
Take the initiative! That's what these forums were founded on!
Just my opinion.
Now go have fun!
JKR said:
I suggest a PM sent to everyone the registers, that is kind of a quick start guide. I understand why the 3 letter limit, because people type words like "the" and "and". I'm not sure how powerful the forum software is, but it would be nice to remove the size limit, and omit such words as mentioned above, from the search.
Regards,
Jason
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
First of all, you get much better, and more detailed search results by using a search-engine like Google. Their advanced search features do a fantastic job, and can be fine tuned to search only through a specific site. (i.e. http://forum.xdadevelopers.com )
Secondly, as opposed to a PM, possibly an email with a confirmation link after the introductory information.
Hope this helps....
Now go have fun!
I think it is more synonymous of the world today, do you read the manual when you buy a new stereo or mobile phone, or do you dig in saying 'nah i know how it works it'll be ok'. People just dont take the time to understand first, they think they know it all and then the proverbial hits the fan! As an experienced R&D firmware developer it doesn't matter how easy I make the interface you will always get those that stuff it up!
So not such an easy one to fix, you have given the masses a place to ask the ridiculous and the tools to stuff up easily, How do you fix that?
Riptos
I've noticed a pattern lately.
1. There has been a large influx of new people that disregard the walkthroughs, wikis and don't know how to search.
2. Our older members have been getting shorter and shorter tempers when it comes to answering n00bs who ask the same questions that have been answered a million times.
So, what are we to do?
The older members need to realize that not everybody is good at using the search feature, which is why I will be writing a walkthrough here. They also need to be a bit more patient with those who genuinely seem to be lost. For those who just don't read, go ahead and flame them. Or at least just give them a link to something and make them read it themselves, that way they feel like "oh... I could've found that myself. Next time, I think I'll search."
How to search:
I understand that the search feature seems somewhat useless because when one searches for say, "how to flash", one gets 20 pages of random things.
So, here are the basics on finding what you need:
Step 1: Check the stickies. The first posts on every forum that say Sticky are posts that were stickied to the top of the forum for a reason. These tend to have all the information you need that people ask often.
Step 2: Know the organization of the forums. I know they're a little crazy. Do you check Herald or Herald upgrading or Herald mobile 6. Usually, if it's related to Window Mobile 6, stick to the Mobile 6 forum.
Step 3: Wikis: If you look at the Herald forum, you'll notice a sticky about the Herald wiki. A wiki, is just that. A wiki. You'll find ALL kinds of useful info.
Step 4: When you search:
Limit your words to ideas. "How to flash" is nice, but "Flashing" or "flash" will do fine.
Words have to be at least 4 letters for it to search for them. Thus "how" and "to" are ignored.
Search titles only first for "how to"s before searching through an entire post. Chances are someone may have already asked the question.
If someone tells you to search for a walkthrough that they wrote, use the find threads by user and find posts by user feature. They're basically telling you everything you need to know to find it.
Ok, so you found a million threads on flashing. Now you see that if you click on thread one, it's not about flashing but it has about 1,300 posts. How can you read EVERY single one of them. When you do a search, if you narrow it down to show results as threads, you'll get the posts themselves that have the words you're looking for an not a thread which mentions "flashing" somewhere in the 1158th post.
One thing, READ EVERY POST, not just the posts that are replies to you. This happens often:
OP: Is it possible to flash my phone with ZOMG teh Best ROM?
1P: What are you trying to flash?
2P: It's impossible. I'm sorry, but ZOMG teh Best ROM was made for HTC's ROFLCOPTER!!!!111 and you have a HTC Normal.
OP: Is it possible to flash my phone with ZOMG teh Best ROM?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
3P: I can try to help you. What kind of phone do you have?
3P: I can try to help you. What kind of phone do you have?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
OP:Awesome thanks!
2P: It's impossible.
OP: Why isn't it working?
2P:
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
This doesn't really talk about the treatment of new people.. but does give a good positive solution which probably will be ignored or forgotten.
it seems quite a few of the people here tend to be jerks to newer people.
the end.
Right to the point
thankx ivanmmj. Indeed a good workthrough
I agree with you abt the newbies. And i seen proof of some circumstances too. Actually for the past 3 days, whenever i check for new post, i find one or two newbie everyday asking mostly abt HOW TO UNLOCK and WHERE TO GET THE ORIGINAL SHIPPED ROMS.
And most of them seem genuinely lost. Sometimes newbies tend to get worried or too excited to check on the search tool. I mean, it isnt everyday that you purchase a new Pocket PC, and then you find out its SIM LOCKED and so on.
And since internet is the answer, we somehow stumble upon this forum and quickly tend to ask question, rather than check on the forum features/threads. Some of us are not the same on that factor.
So its in my suggestion that we create a separate forum for these special areas of need and of Original Shipped Roms page. But anyways this is jus an idea.
And yes abt how newbies are treated, i guess it wud be a lot easier that we direct them to the correct thread with the advice of search tool, instead of blaming anyone to JUST use search tool. I mean, they are newbies, how can they jus know which term to specifically search or how credible a search result is. And a post to the right direction for a newbie, minimizes them from posting again and again and again. It really helps!!!!
yeah Im a jerk...
thx
good to know
I really dont see any point in this "walkthrough"
Dont get me wrong here, its a good idea, but a old one
NO MATTER how many guides, rules, walkthroughs w/e anyone try to make, the socalled nOOb thing will always be present.
Its been tried before, here, and in thousands of other forums
PPL wants quickfix, they dont wanna search, they want us to personally guide them or walk them through everything.
If we make a BIG flashing announcement, most ppl will never care to read. They come to get something cool and leave. They come back if there is a error or a bug and flame us, many times in pm and on msn.
I have considered remove my msn from xda, but I dont because I occationally get some nice contacts.
Since I joined xda, my pm inbox has a couple thousand pm's, half is what I consider junk...
If we are such jerks, then just stay away from our work and our threads, go to those who answer all your questions with a wagging tail.
I have spendt so many hours on this that I dont even wanna think about it, and I get accused that I do it for fame, glory, and w/e
I DONT CARE
you wanna know why I keep releasing builds here after I got my kaiser? I do it because there is some friends here that have asked if I could continue.
I could easily put my roms in private network, but I choose to share what I do, for free....
So if thats beeing a jerk, then im happy to be one. I would rather be a jerk then the opposite.
have a nice day
ayyu3m said:
thankx ivanmmj. Indeed a good workthrough
I agree with you abt the newbies. And i seen proof of some circumstances too. Actually for the past 3 days, whenever i check for new post, i find one or two newbie everyday asking mostly abt HOW TO UNLOCK and WHERE TO GET THE ORIGINAL SHIPPED ROMS.
And most of them seem genuinely lost. Sometimes newbies tend to get worried or too excited to check on the search tool. I mean, it isnt everyday that you purchase a new Pocket PC, and then you find out its SIM LOCKED and so on.
And since internet is the answer, we somehow stumble upon this forum and quickly tend to ask question, rather than check on the forum features/threads. Some of us are not the same on that factor.
So its in my suggestion that we create a separate forum for these special areas of need and of Original Shipped Roms page. But anyways this is jus an idea.
And yes abt how newbies are treated, i guess it wud be a lot easier that we direct them to the correct thread with the advice of search tool, instead of blaming anyone to JUST use search tool. I mean, they are newbies, how can they jus know which term to specifically search or how credible a search result is. And a post to the right direction for a newbie, minimizes them from posting again and again and again. It really helps!!!!
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Ditto.
I have noticed the flaming as well, not just in the herald forum, but in others as well. It is unfortunate and it is my hope that it'll change. I more or less just post the link or post number and move on.
I completely agree with you and totally support Ivanmmj's efforts to minimize countless and repetitive posts requesting/asking the same questions on multiple threads. I, as well as every other "senior" and experienced "junior" member were once nOObs. Regardless, Ivanmmj's efforts are applauded and I thank you.
ITJE .. realize that you are talented and post some of most unique roms here. So of course, many people here are going to consider you as a guru. You may not consider yourself as one, but others do. I don't consider you a jerk in the least, but if you truly didn't care and if you didn't feel you have abolutely nothing to contribute, you would not be here. You've made it abundantly clear "why" you're here now and I thank you for sharing that. Maybe putting your roms in/on a private network might work for you and your friends. Just a thought. You will be missed for sure.
I can truly understand your frustration, but we (senior, juniors, gurus, gurus in-training, even nOObs) truly need to remain positive and objective instead of flaming or blaming. All I want to do is be a support and encourage what you're good at and enjoy (here, lol).
Just thinking if the search could be predominate on the page -- like a huge search box in red or something ???? Then maybe people would use it.
I personally do my best to help people, and always try to steer them clear of PMing or IMing ITJE... because I know how "annoying" it can be to receive thousands of messages from people on here asking the simplest questions.
ITJE, everyone here appreciates your work, and I hate to see you get upset because of a couple of idiots who piss you off when you work so hard for us expecting nothing in return. So let me take this time to apologize on behalf of everyone here and thank you on behalf of everyone for all of your efforts.
It is most certainly true what you say that the n00b will always be present, so I think that the rest of us, need to take those situations and help them n00bs hence alleviating ITJE's responsibility from doing so. It's obvious that most people don't like to read everything and search for answers when it's always easier to ask ask ask.... but in my opinion, that's the whole basis of XDA ... to help others. So basically, what we need to do is a community effort.
All the n00bsout there, PLEASE PLEASE help us, by trying to help yourselves first. We want to help you, we will help you, but you need to do your part in helping us help you. All the information you could ever need is located in this forum.
USE THE SEARCH FUNCTION ON THE FORUM OR USE THE GOOGLE SEARCH of the site in order to search for solutions to your issues.
To the Seniors and Juniors out there, we need to try to be more patient with n00bs... going back and remembering how WE at some point were in that same position. Let's not forget the whole premise of why this site exists and continues to excel in its purpose.
To the COOKS who donate your time, effort, and expertise. Thank you. While some people, primarily because of ignorance, may not appreciate your efforts, please know that we who have been here and know your efforts, whole-heartedly appreciate you and everything you contribute. If it weren't for you, this website wouldn't exist. I know it must be terribly frustrating to have everyone criticizing, complaining and it may feel like they are pissing on your work which you donate selflessly to this site, but know that the majority of us do in fact appreciate what you do more than we express to you.
The search function on this forum is just plain terrible. Either that or I don't know how to search and will look forward to the walkthrough. But even displaying posts instead of threads does not help very much.
My two cents for those trying to search....use google instead and add "site:forum.xda-developers.com" in the search box. At least those results are easier to look through.
ITJE .. realize that you are talented and post some of most unique roms here. So of course, many people here are going to consider you as a guru. You may not consider yourself as one, but others do. I don't consider you a jerk in the least, but if you truly didn't care and if you didn't feel you have abolutely nothing to contribute, you would not be here. You've made it abundantly clear "why" you're here now and I thank you for sharing that. Maybe putting your roms in/on a private network might work for you and your friends. Just a thought. You will be missed for sure.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Is that a hint, like..piss off (edit: I AM joking )
jk
I never said I would do that, I said the opposite.
I said I am a jerk cause im staying here.
I dont see what some call flaming of newbees
Its a reaction to lazyness
when sollutions is posted in the post #1 and 2, or maybe 3....written in big letters, and in a thread counting 40-50 replies, the same question is asked in about 10% or more, maybe even asked 1 or 2 pages after the answer or/and the sollution, then..well...
Maybe im not the most patient guy in the world, and I certainly have not tried to be either, but usually I try my best to provide the help I can or am able/willing to give.
And about that "Made it clear why im here thing"
Im here to share my work with all who wants it.
When I got my Kaiser/Tytn2, I decided tomove over there with my work, and sell off my herald. But I was convinced to stay and continue do some work.
And no one can say that I was not called a jerk, cause yes, I obviously do "flame" the socalled nOObs.
Most of it are sarcastic, but its also the truth.
I dont accept that my threads are spammed with 50% bull**** and the same questions over and over.
No matter what I write..Dont spam, read before you ask, use search through google/xda w/e
PPL DONT SEE IT
The jump clear cause they are lazy, they see the message, READ THIS, but they dont.
If I in.ex write like this, on top of the release:
There is a bug with MMS in this release, I am working on it.
Then there will be atleast 5-6 ppl saying MMS is not working, and telling me the rom is unstable because of this
Hell, I even had a guy typing in biggest letters available
WARNING DONT USE THIS ROM, INTERNETSHARING IS NOT WORKING (something like that)
I respect all who wants to contribute, to share what they know.
I respect those who dont know anything, but hangs around, download w/e and use w/e is posted here.
I do NOT respect ppl who comes in and claim they have used search, and not found anything.
Maybe my searchbutton is the only one working, cause sometimes when ppl claim they have been using search, and could not find anything. I tested and did same search and got many hits within 3-5 posts, and found what they had searched for with no problem....
I do not respect ppl whos first and second post is about the flaws in a rom they just downloaded
"I have been around for many years and know my way around the forums, and I know how to find stuff" and they got a postcount that say 5, and they ask questions that makes me wonder if they have a teflon brain, cause if you have been around xda for a long time, and dont even know how to soft and hard reset, then....
I might seam angry in what I have written, or sad, or w/e
Im not
Im just amazed..
cause im a jerk
Totally irrelevant but Itje, you remind me of my best friend of 17 years and he lives 1,500 miles away from me. . He'll say things that sound crude and mean, but underneath, he's truly genuine and warm hearted. My point is that you're a softy . Just joking.
I lately tend to simply ignore questions which I'm sure I have seen a few pages ago or very very close at the beginning.
I fully agree with Itje that it is pure laziness if somebody says he read the thread or spent some time in solving his problems
if the solution to the question is written in the first, second or third post or maybe still on the first page.
It feels like a slap in the face and has the taste of a being lied to, so I rather ignore those person/question and
wish that others who once asked the same question jump in for help and give something back to the forum.
That's the spirit of this forum.
PS: I dont like flaming either, but often it's totally understandable, but still it's wrong.
No offense.. but i've been around here for a long time. I don't post a lot, but I do a lot of reading. I also have been active on many many different boards. What gets me about this board and many others is that some people think they have a whole bunch of clout just because the post a lot.. well whoopty freakin doo..
In regards to the search subject: searching here is a pain in the arse. Nobody's topics are clear, and you can describe what you are looking for in a million different ways. So, what you are trying to fix will not be fixed. The only thing that would be lovely to see change would be to see the flamers come down off their high forum poster horses and join the rest of us on Earth.
Start flame now...
<drunk rant>
To follow up with my claims about topics.. here is an example that caused me to ask for help. This topic:
Sticky: A Herald's Guide to Flashing Aserg, USPL and HARD-SPL
Ok.. so I had done Open Touch 2.3 or something and taken a few weeks from reading the forums and I come back and Open Touch 2.7 was just an NBH file.. so i read the wiki, which leads you to dead links, or at least it did that week when I was trying to figure this out. But here is my issue with that topic.. I look at that I and I think.. "Flashing Aserg" In my mind I think, that's not for me, I don't want or even know what ASERG is, nor USPL nor Hard SPL.. I'm looking for "NBH" right?? Nothing helpful came up. Try searching in the Herald forum for "how to flash nbh" see what you get... unless it's a very specific string you are looking for, good luck.
A fix to that topic? how bout: Sticky: A Herald's Guide to Flashing --using-- Aserg, USPL and HARD-SPL
That would have at least got me into that subject.. and guess what.. there the answer I needed lies.
I finally got it thanks to duprade and ttran001 in this thread that i hijacked: http://forum.xda-developers.com/showthread.php?t=362986&page=2
Neither of them flamed.. good dudes.
</drunk rant>
So just to keep you all informed.
Not only in forums but also in Moderator-Talk we are discussing the problem of flaming...
... and there are several point of start...
- more and more people wnat ALL for free and want it personalized to themselfe (like all around the world in "real life"
- reading is time = time is money = all for free = no reading...
- xda is GROWING - when you can get a XDA TErra for 40€ with contract also "young" (i mean yound brains" start buying a PPC for chatting and all that..... But aren´t used to read... jk
- blaming is on of the BEST FREETIME game: see "Big Idol", "Superstar" or ALL the castingsshows round the world.
So what I want to say... the world is getting worse - and that wouldn´t take a break on XDA-dev.
BUT all have to work on it.
Flar - our admin - is working on the searchfunction!!!!
Cookers - maybe the releases must have BIG letters!
Moderator - please don´t take part on flaming and advise other who are blaming
Seniors - please keep helping each other
Noobs - pleas read, read, read
AND to ALL: Please let´s start to keep threads clean again...
A thread with 200post and 20 pages BEFORE the rom is released is NOT the way it should be...
And posts like:
1.: "You are releasing - great"
2.: "I´m downloading"
3.: "Flashing process 80%"
4.: "Flashing 99%"
5.: "Booting"
6.: "I will test...."
7.: "I will report..."
8.: "SO after testing for a while I found ......"
I think to start with post #8 would be the best way to keep threads clean...
Thanks.
Not sure if Ignoring is the answer ....................
If those who know just ignore the questions, then Only Noobs will answer Noobs..........
And if a Noob follows a Noob then both will fall into a pit.
robosiris said:
Totally irrelevant but Itje, you remind me of my best friend of 17 years and he lives 1,500 miles away from me. . He'll say things that sound crude and mean, but underneath, he's truly genuine and warm hearted. My point is that you're a softy . Just joking.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
yeah, Im a soft Jerk
zcink said:
If those who know just ignore the questions, then Only Noobs will answer Noobs..........
And if a Noob follows a Noob then both will fall into a pit.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
If we use all our focus on answering the same questions over and over again, then we would spend less time cooking and figuring out the socalled bugs.
your loss...
But from what I understand, in you guys oppinion, we are supposed to answer everyone, no matter what, no matter how many times the same question is asked in a thread, and even if there is a thread with the sollution, maybe even a sticky?
You suggest that we give them a link to the post containing the answer, are we supposed to keep a Favourite list with a link to all answers we have supplied? and that we scroll through it to find the right one and post it?
Or maybe we could use search function? yeah wow, lets do all the work for the newbees...
NO MATTER what I write...its wrong
If I tell them to search, to use either google or searchfunction, they all claim to not find it (most do)
If I guide them to the answer, they keep coming asking next time, and next time and next time. Because they get the answers with no work trying to find it.
This might sound harsh or w/e
But every time I do try to help ppl out, they start adding me to msn, and pm me all the time asking for help and a personalized rom. They start acting as we are old time buddies, and whats next step? Im gonna be everones personal chef?
so im sure you wiseguys have a answer for that to, im sure. But thats because you just dont have a clue what this is all about.
Sure you help out with diffrent issues, and talk nicly to the newbees, thats totally cool with me.
Im sure you even like it, and that nice too.
Maybe we could call it "your function here"
and then I must add, thats not my function here.
Im no good with the "nOOb's" asking the same over and over (....)
A while back I was told (when a similar topic was brought up) just ignore them, and many agreed.
Basicly, thats not an option anymore either
SO, what I figure from all this, is that no matter what I do, im a jerk if I state what I feel in the matter, im a jerk if I ignore the questions.
The biggest problem beeing a person that help everyone out, is that more and more ppl comes to you, because you get a reputation that you are nice, helping and commited. But how much can a person contribute?
to be honest I feel that I am in a situation where I wish I could just cut all this out, I feel that no matter what I say or do, it tends to lead the wrong way.
I love making roms, its a great hobby. I like to help out, but I really dont have the time to get involved personally with everyones issues, everyones new fantastic ideas and cook a personal rom with this or that added, or this and that removed
Im not a bad guy, im not a angry pissed of guy who flames everyone who ask for my help. I have guided many on msn, mail and pm.
I try to look into the problems reported in my roms, and I try fix it. Even if I dont give a answer always to reporte bugs, I do note them, and I try to fix.
But I do have a family, I do have a job, and I do have other interests besides rom cooking.
Occationaly the cup runs over, we get tired of repeating ourself, and we answer in a sarcastic way.
im taking a break from this.
have fun all
zcink said:
If those who know just ignore the questions, then Only Noobs will answer Noobs..........
And if a Noob follows a Noob then both will fall into a pit.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Of course ignoring is the best answer, but it helps me from starting giving harsh answers.
I rather say nothing if I'm pissed than start blaming and complaining.
Instead of offending the person I rather keep quiet and really hope that people
who get the exact answer once assist with the same answer.
It has nothing to do with noobs helping noobs. It's more about sharing the same spirit to the whole community,
I really don't understand why only a group and always the same has to stand here and help, help, help.
None of us bought the knowledge with buying a PPC, we all sent down and read, read, read.
Things are free here, so the very least people can do is read.
One thing I really would like to see is, that we all should collect the bugs and solutions found over time
and pass it over to the moderator and/or cook to combine them on teh first page as those post are reserved already.
Like this you really can answer the so called stupid question with look in post #3 for the issue.
Like this we could keep the thread clean with all the bull**** as papamopps described.
And since I'm also one of those thread trashers who writes those useless "Thanks for the release" or "Your ROM looks awsome" posts
I will stop with that but try to give more constructive comments.
And even we seniors are not all knowing, I still learn a lot while hanging out here.
Post counts means nothing else than the activeness of a member does not necessarily reflects his knowledge about PPC.
And just like in real life, you don't approach a group of stranger who are in a conversation and start talking or even ask questions.
You listen first and slowly move along the conversation.
That's common etiquette and not just for grown ups also for the younger folks.
Those are common manners around the world.
We are all no employees of XDA-DEV we are all volounteers, so we really deserve the right whether to answer or not.
If we get paid for this I will even tell time and the weather forecast if that's the question ask
As long I'm here in my FREE time I choose whom to answer and whom not.
Cheers
@ Itje
101% behind you thoughts, I prefer being called a jerk too and stick with you guys. Having a good time here is more important for me and if I can only achieve that with ignoring some others, then it's a fair and low price.
I understand all the frustration over this. I apologize if my comment offended anyone. I was half joking. When I first came here, I had question and was just ignored. I always appreciated any help I got no matter how silly. Even now I find it difficult to search here.
I still think the search engine here should be tweaked so its easy to use and goes right to the right threads. One day I read 29 threads before I got the answer to the question I was searching for. I can see why people just ask -- it is irritating to some but easier for those seeking the answers.
anyway, yeah I guess you can just ignore the questions. I mean nobody is obligated to answer anyone.
i just got the att tilt and i was wondering if there is any software or programs that will allow you to watch videos on break.com? cause when i go to it it says get flash. i have the flash bundle and tcmp which lets me watch youtube so im just wondering about break and also other sites that use flash. Also something where i can look at myspace.com normally?
well hope you can help....thanks
Amazing....
Simply apply the same type of replies to THIS thread as your OTHER thread, found here:
http://forum.xda-developers.com/showthread.php?t=373779
HELP YOURSELF! THIS IS NOT A BABY SITTING WEBSITE!
the thing is i have been searching for answers but i havnt found anything concrete and it has been in different threads for different things so i was hoping to get a concrete answer....mans ur just wasting more time on just complaining then just helping.
Have you ever stopped to think about why it's so hard to find an answer???? Because you have to sort though 1,000,000's of useless threads (like this one).
I did a search BEFORE I posted the first reply. Low and behold!!!!! THE ANSWER WAS THERE!
If you have a question, you can bet it has already been asked, many times! Just because it is YOUR first day here, dosent mean it is the first day for these forums to be here and other members to be here!
Sure, I could have just linked to it, but then what is this BB? A bunch of threads that map to other threads that map to other threads?
GET REAL! Nobody here is your personal assistant!
grizzley said:
Have you ever stopped to think about why it's so hard to find an answer???? Because you have to sort though 1,000,000's of useless threads (like this one).
I did a search BEFORE I posted the first reply. Low and behold!!!!! THE ANSWER WAS THERE!
If you have a question, you can bet it has already been asked, many times! Just because it is YOUR first day here, dosent mean it is the first day for these forums to be here and other members to be here!
Sure, I could have just linked to it, but then what is this BB? A bunch of threads that map to other threads that map to other threads?
GET REAL! Nobody here is your personal assistant!
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lol grizzley...he DOES have a personal assistant
the "search" button
I fully understand how new people asking questions about something they need help with would be annoying?!? (sarcasm) But I have searched for certain items on this site a few times and may have found the item I was looking for, but have not known it. Not everyone on this site has time to sit 24 hours and learn every term and name of the things we are searching. Granted the video aspect of the Kaiser has been brought up in multiple threads and a search was warranted.......but being a jerk is not helping the cause either. I wasted more time reading your assanine comments than figuring out what the answer may have been.
I am on my 6th HTC branded PPC and still I consider myself a nOOb at all of this .......funny thing is , is that , I do not ask any questions about things on this site.....even if I have searched.......because of the flaming it causes by the know it alls!
Go ahead and flame me for only haveing 20 posts ...if that.....but I do not post because of jackholes acting all high and mighty like you all keep doing in almost every thread on this site!
My vent so take it how you want!
it just seems like that the only thing these jerks do is just sit around all day on the forums and just look at them and thats it....sorry some people have lives that cant just sit here and know everything that is on this forum...and yes i did searches like i have said....i have the video **** done....like i said for youtube but i was wondering about flash sites and break.com wouldve been simple to just read it and answer it and not be a [email protected]@! get over yourselves and get lives.
I just installed the Slueth rom that has touchflo and im not sure how to get it to work. can some one point me to the right direction. i have the att tilt.
I don't flame, I'm not going to say much, but...
Read, this site is full of resources and answers to all your questions.
If you promise to learn to search and read next time, I'll even spoon feed you a little to get you started.
First:
http://wiki.xda-developers.com/index.php?pagename=TouchFlo
Check that out, TouchFlo doesn't mean much, other than scrolling with a finger.
Also, read the to find all of the apps the give the "TouchFlo" interface you are looking for.
From there, search, and learn...
how many threads do you have to start?? i count 5 itself today
did you even bother to use the search? wait dont even answer that......do you even know that there's a search button up there?
this is why im asking question because that linkt old me nothing why its not working on my tilt. its there and shows it in the programs but its a setting for sound only.
i ask questions because this is a forum. im sorry if i piss ppl off but im just asking for help. that link didnt help at all. a direct answer is all im asking.
of course i know theres a search button but its not helping. all it does is point me to many threads that go on and on with not ending nor help. this is a forum board and its ment for asking questions. it dont matter how many i ask in a day this is what this is here for.
idle0095 said:
of course i know theres a search button but its not helping. all it does is point me to many threads that go on and on with not ending nor help. this is a forum board and its ment for asking questions. it dont matter how many i ask in a day this is what this is here for.
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this forum is not meant for asking questions, especially question like that
kyphur said:
I think what a lot of people forget is that this is not a "make my phone neat & kewl" place.
As implied by the name this is technically a Developers forum/community.
Now what does that mean? Well first off it means that there is an expectation that if you are here then you want to customize your device but rather than just installing something that someone packaged you want to understand how it works and maybe even enhance it yourself.
When I first came here with a Blue Angel it was a different environment. PDA Phones were not embraced by the general public because of the expense and complexity (I paid over $400 for my BA). A $400 phone 4 years ago was expensive, today the Tilt is $300 after rebates but with inflation & the rise in the cost of ther devices and the fact that there are other sources out there giving them away for $150 our neat bit of kit has become popular with mainstream users.
Now we have a flood of new users who are asking not "How can I do this myself" but more like "Give me the quick fix" without caring to understand the process. See if you read the threads then you get to experience the learnign process, you see how the issues were investigated and confirmed. THen you get to watch the different attempts at resolution and learn why some failed while others worked. That is called Development.
The NooB backlash is coming from users who have walked in the development shoes and is directed mainly at those who don't care for the journey but just want the end result or destination.
As a Development Forum we are just as much (if not more) about the journey. I've read so many comments like "I don't have time to read all of the threads" or "I don't care how it works, just that it does". These very statements are contrary to the heart & soul of XDA-Devs and that is why the backlash is so strong.
Let me be very clear on this: IF YOU DON'T CARE ABOUT UNDERSTANDING THE JOURNEY THEN YOU PROBABLY SHOULDN'T BE HERE IN THE FIRST PLACE.
XDA-Devs is about developers & hackers helping each other and working together to get the most out of our devices by understanding them better that most.
XDA-Devs is not about helping everyone who wants a "Kewl bit of kit" make their phone better than the guy next to him.
Now do we go kicking users off who never contribute anything, NO. We tolerate it to an extent. Where the toleration ends is when these users start diluting the usefulness of the forum by repeating the same questions over and over again.
You ask us to understand your position. We if you want to benefit from our experience and time then I think it is only fair that you understand our position.
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idle0095 said:
of course i know theres a search button but its not helping. all it does is point me to many threads that go on and on with not ending nor help. this is a forum board and its ment for asking questions. it dont matter how many i ask in a day this is what this is here for.
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So this will be the second thread i will be closing, we do need you to start using the search function and even if the results are a long read you should ALWAYS read through the entire threads.....impatience is showing in your posts and that is not a good thing.
The less you work for yourself the less likely we are here to try to help you.....many people have spent alot of time writing guides and information to help people out so please respect the work done here and take your time to read.