Related
Has anyone else notice the touch screen being very inaccurate on their kaiser? I mostly notice it in the dialer. For example i press 5 and it does 8 instead. Sometimes i even hit 2 and get 8 which is really bizzare. I'm using the HTC dialer, so maybe thats the issue. I'm going to switch to the windows dialer tonight and see if thats any better. I also have problems getting it to recognize presses at all sometimes. Sometimes i have to press the screen so hard that it distorts (i know thats bad for it but i just get so frustrated, especially when the photo album randomly opens while im on the phone, and then when i need to use the keypad I can't get the damn album to close because the screen doesnt recognize my tap, or thinks im tapping somewhere else. I've ran the screen alignment a few times, and tried doing it with my finger and with the stylus. Do i just have a dud?
Josh
Have you tried realigning the screen? Pretty basic stuff.
I have the same exact problem. Especially with the numbers. I switched to the other dialer (no video cal one) and its still the same. I have calibrated tons butits no better.
Yes, as i said, i've ran the screen alignment numerous times, and tried it both with the stylus and with my finger.
yea, i have teh same problem.. its definiately not a realignement problem.
It happens with the htc dialpad, and somtimes the htc skined calculator
i thought maybe it could be touchflo.. i didnt have this problem at all with the 8525
And I thought it just me!
I get this problem too when using the dialler (both HTC and WM6).
Looks like a few of us have this problem. I notice it on the today screen using HTC home, i go to tap the weather icon and end up opening the clock. Try diabling the touch cube (if you have it installed) seemed to improve things for me.
vlad69uk said:
Looks like a few of us have this problem. I notice it on the today screen using HTC home, i go to tap the weather icon and end up opening the clock. Try diabling the touch cube (if you have it installed) seemed to improve things for me.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I've noticed this. I always align my screen with the stylus to get the best accuracy but when certain app's are loaded that are designed for finger use, they change the touch-screen sensitivity so that when you need to use the stylus again for small items, its all screwed up!
I found if I stick to what the unit is designed for its OK!
Farsquidge said:
I've noticed this. I always align my screen with the stylus to get the best accuracy but when certain app's are loaded that are designed for finger use, they change the touch-screen sensitivity so that when you need to use the stylus again for small items, its all screwed up!
I found if I stick to what the unit is designed for its OK!
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
So the Kaiser was not designed to make phone calls? Perhaps you are supposed to only dial people from your contact list (synced from MS Outlook of course) or use MS Voice Command?
jgermuga said:
So the Kaiser was not designed to make phone calls? Perhaps you are supposed to only dial people from your contact list (synced from MS Outlook of course) or use MS Voice Command?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Oh, here we go...
NO, what I meant is that if you want an iPod type interface then buy one. The 'Kaiser' comes with a stylus that gives you precise touch input.
To use a 'grubby' finger to gain access the touch interface has to be 'DE-Tuned' to accept an approximation input and once an app that does this is installed you will have to accept some changes for precise input apps you already have!
For pity's sake, some people expect things out of this device even a Tablet laptop could not provide!!!
Farsquidge said:
Oh, here we go...
NO, what I meant is that if you want an iPod type interface then buy one. The 'Kaiser' comes with a stylus that gives you precise touch input.
To use a 'grubby' finger to gain access the touch interface has to be 'DE-Tuned' to accept an approximation input and once an app that does this is installed you will have to accept some changes for precise input apps you already have!
For pity's sake, some people expect things out of this device even a Tablet laptop could not provide!!!
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Well I guess we'll have to agree to disagree. I have always found the phone dialer to be a problem and after 4 device iterations and 3 OS iterations, you would think it could be resolved.
Plus, HTC included TouchFlo on this device, which to me is also severely flawed to the point of being worthless. Even so, this sets the expectation that you can use your "grubby" finger when you need to, not only to dial a phone number but to scroll a contact list.
I don't get why you toss out constant excuses for the Kaiser not being designed to do this, that or the other thing. As far as I am concerned, I paid 3 times the cost of a modest dedicated GPS, dedicated PMP and a phone to get it all in one CONVERGED device. If only I wanted a phone, I would have bought a phone, if only I wanted an MPS player I would have bought an MP3 player, etc, etc, but I opted to pay much (much, much) more for the ability to get all these things in ONE device. So why should I not have a right to be disappointed with problems that linger for years and years, or for poor implementation of features that had better support on lesser devices, such as video playback.
Granted, HTC does not out this product as a media player, but given that it is similar in design to previous models, which did at least an adequate job, has left many people who thought they were upgrading feeling disappointed. Plus, it is VERY difficult to try all these features out before making a decision, and when people come to place like this forum to ask questions, they get flamed.
It seems your solution to the disappointment is to buy a fanny pack and load it up with a camera, a game player, an mp3 player, a personal media player, a phone, a GPS... and what the heck, we'll even throw in a Kindle for good measure.
What's up? Do you sell fanny packs?
jgermuga said:
Well I guess we'll have to agree to disagree. I have always found the phone dialer to be a problem and after 4 device iterations and 3 OS iterations, you would think it could be resolved.
Plus, HTC included TouchFlo on this device, which to me is also severely flawed to the point of being worthless. Even so, this sets the expectation that you can use your "grubby" finger when you need to, not only to dial a phone number but to scroll a contact list.
I don't get why you toss out constant excuses for the Kaiser not being designed to do this, that or the other thing. As far as I am concerned, I paid 3 times the cost of a modest dedicated GPS, dedicated PMP and a phone to get it all in one CONVERGED device. If only I wanted a phone, I would have bought a phone, if only I wanted an MPS player I would have bought an MP3 player, etc, etc, but I opted to pay much (much, much) more for the ability to get all these things in ONE device. So why should I not have a right to be disappointed with problems that linger for years and years, or for poor implementation of features that had better support on lesser devices, such as video playback.
Granted, HTC does not out this product as a media player, but given that it is similar in design to previous models, which did at least an adequate job, has left many people who thought they were upgrading feeling disappointed. Plus, it is VERY difficult to try all these features out before making a decision, and when people come to place like this forum to ask questions, they get flamed.
It seems your solution to the disappointment is to buy a fanny pack and load it up with a camera, a game player, an mp3 player, a personal media player, a phone, a GPS... and what the heck, we'll even throw in a Kindle for good measure.
What's up? Do you sell fanny packs?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
My only advice to people who constantly moan about the device like you do is take it back or sell it!!
It obviously is not what you want so why do you keep it??
Sure, that's easy to say. I'll just go and drop another $500+ on a phone and memory card. What the heck. It's only money, right? And while I'm at it, I'll just plop down another $200 for getting out of my AT&T contract. And then keep my fingers crossed I can get a decent price off eBay. And that's even before spending time reflashing the AT&t ROM to stock and getting an unlock code. Cmon, get real.
If the Nokia N95 had a touch screen or the Sony W960i had support for AT&T bands, I would have already dropped this model. I could use a break from WinMo anyway. To bad Symbian isn't as popular on this side of the pond.
Otherwise, I don't see any non-HTC phones other then the E-Ten X800 that I would consider a major upgrade to my 8125. I sat on the sidelines for the Tytn I because I wanted on board GPS. What a poor tradeoff that turned out to be. It is likely I will wind up going with a T-Mobile Shadow keep the phone and and break the contract, which would still be cheaper than what I paid for the Tilt after the AT&T deal. Hopefully I'll be able to come out even after all is said and done. At least it is smaller and cheaper.
I'd wait for the Cruise but I am not too thrilled to pay nearly 3/4 of a grand for something that can't render video.
Yes, I am frustrated. From the AT&T bloatware to the lack of accessories (it didn't even come with a case????) to the video driver problems, the TouchFlo not working, yada yada yada, I've had it with this phone. I actually liked my 8125 better, and as a basis of comparison, I saw far fewer complaints about that model when it was the top dog.
So sad to say, the Kaiser looks great on paper, but it falls short on implementation.
These are the first impressions of a power user after a week with the Diamond - I hope they might help others to decide whether to get one.
EDIT: Things have moved on since this post, you might want to look at post #39 too (page 4)
Background
I'm a power user but also a heavy day-to-day user as well. I use my phone for calling people, basic PDA functions, OTA google sync, web access, IMAP mail, GPS and also .NET software development. (I'm the author of 'Touch Settings') I used to have an HTC Touch. Before that, an HTC Prophet. Before that, an HTC MDA Compact.. ..you get the idea. I like HTC devices. I've stuck with them all, put up with their frustrations and watched them steadily improve. But this phone felt like the most exciting release yet. A massive leap forward in terms of specs. I was calling up Orange for about a month to find out the ETA. I actually RAN to the Orange Shop in Oxford Street and managed to get their last one in stock at the weekend!
So, one week in, here we go...
Great things
THE SCREEN
My favourite thing is the VGA screen. I cannot believe the difference it makes to the look of the phone, seriously. I could never go back to QVGA again now, this is a major improvement. Just reading the operator name in a slim, Arial-Narrow type font at the top of the screen and not being able to see the individual pixels, this is a true step forward. Everything, repeat, EVERYTHING looks better.
THE CAMERA
The auto-focus camera is nothing short of brilliant. Still rubbish in low-light levels, still no flash, but this is light-years ahead of the last one! I still get a little smirk of delight on my face when I hear it whirring as it focuses ahead of taking a picture!
A FASTER PROCESSOR
Hooray! FINALLY!... 528MHz ...4 times faster than my HTC Touch!...in theory. See below.
THE NEW ADD-ONS
Having GPS, FM radio, a tilt switch, a light sensor and more is fantastic. Teeter, the game, is awesome and will impress every person you know at a party.
THE SIZE
The Diamond is slightly smaller than the HTC Touch as well - easier to fit in a pocket. And it really does look gorgeous. Well done HTC.
Enough praise. Because then there's all this:
The Not-so-great things:
THE SPEED
Pop Quiz. Take your Windows Mobile phone. Tap the start button. Then tap 'Programs'. Does the window flash onto your screen immediately? No. There's a delay, isn't there? And sometimes you can even see it drawing every individual icon, top-to-bottom. On my HTC Touch, after a day of use, this took about 2 seconds.
On the Diamond, with TouchFlo 3D running, it's worse.
Skip this paragraph if you don't want a rant. Seriously, when are Windows Mobile phones actually going to get responsive enough to be useable? Delays when you press buttons, delays when you bring up menus, switch applications, etc, etc. What the hell is this operating system DOING with those 537 mega cycles per second??? Having patiently waited through my last THREE sloooow devices, I was thrilled at the thought of a phone that actually whizzed along... ...but it's a bit like going from XP on a slow computer to Vista on a fast computer - no noticable increase in speed at all. Such a crushing disappointment. My old Nokia could re-draw a screen faster 3 years ago. In this day and age, and with a processor doing a belting 500+ MHz, this should NOT be happening. Things should appear INSTANTLY and react the VERY MOMENT you touch them. I am running out of patience. The iPhone is looking more attactive every day.
TFL3D - INTERFACE
Fantastic to look at, but surprisngly sluggish to use. The more days that pass, the more it's becoming apparent that this interface is more about form and less about function. It's also often lacking in visual feedback; sometimes a button will move when you drag it (main nav bar at the bottom), sometimes not! You just have to swipe and see! Visual feedback is a very important part of user interface design.
COMMON ACTIONS, E.G. CALLING PEOPLE
I feel that, action-wise, some things have (incredibly) got HARDER since my HTC Touch. For example, I used to be able to call my favourite contacts with a swipe and a tap.. ..now it's a swipe, a complicated side-swipey thing, a painstaking wait for the piccies to flip around, and finally a tap. Er, hello? This is the MAIN THING I USE THE PHONE FOR - CALLING PEOPLE! I can't even position my favourite contacts in memorable places; again, a big factor in user interface design, hence why you remember where your icons are on your PC's desktop.
HOME SCREEN (TFL3D again really)
I can't add any custom home screen items! What the hell happened to being able to view my list of things to do? (tasks) Seriously, this is a shockingly bad step back. I know there are some apps to work around this, but I'm doing a review of the stock phone and software here.
THE JOYPAD
This should be renamed the joy-less pad. It's virtually impossible to click the Left and Right buttons without frequently mis-tapping and hitting the 'Back' or 'Hang Up' keys instead. There are no markings, you just sort of have to 'guess' where abouts on the flat screen to tap. The actual target area isn't big enough and I'm getting sick of quitting out of screens when I just want to move right or left. I've got fairly big hands but I'm no elephant.
The ipod-style 'whiz-around' wheel seems promising but when you try it, it's under-responsive and jerky in its movements. I would suggest that's why they've limited the applications that support it by default.
NO MINI SD CARD SLOT
Another step back - from 8Gb storage on my HTC Touch (with a mini SD card) to a paltry 4Gb now. Not enough to put all my music on the phone plus nav software, and no slot for more storage.
GROSS GREASINESS
As other forum users have pointed out, all that swiping on this shiny black device - it looks like the back of a transit van after a minute or so of use.
CONCLUSION
Owning an HTC Diamond is without doubt a step forward from an HTC Touch, but it's a smaller step than you might think. Be prepared for a mixed bag of emotions. Joy at the look of the thing, disappointment when you realise it's slower than you hoped, shouts of happiness when you first play 'Teeter', cries of frustration when the screen turns off randomly during calls or you miss-hit the joypad button or you can't swipe the tiny bit of the screen you're meant to.
After all that, I might surprise you by saying this. I would still say this phone is the best option on the market for the day-to-day user who wants an ultra-portable device that packs enough power to do that bit more than just making calls.
Just 24 hours into owning the phone I did my first ROM flash, from 1.37...1 to 1.37...3 - and this helped the speed somewhat and fixed a memory leak. I also tweaked the registry as much as I could. This has helped too, but the above problems are all still too evident, nothing has really improved enough to make me retract any of them. Keep watching these forums, though, because future ROM updates have the power to make this device much, much better.
That's about it, I hope these comments have helped, or given you something to debate in the space below. I'm going to stick with the Diamond for now. But I wouldn't mind betting I'll have completely disabled TouchFlo 3D before the week is out...
Carlos
I too wonder how long I will last with TF3D. However, the joypad is no problem. Simply use the centre button as a reference point. If you rest part of your thumb in there and press any side of it, then it is easy to navigate. At least I find it easy anyway. Hope that might help you.
carlosp_uk said:
I was calling up Orange for about a month to find out the ETA. I actually RAN to the Orange Shop in Oxford Street and managed to get their last one in stock at the weekend!
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
If you were really a fan you would have made sure you were the first, and didn't have to run
mcwtrekkie said:
If you were really a fan you would have made sure you were the first, and didn't have to run
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I think I may well have been Orange's first online order! Could not wait.
evilskanker said:
I think I may well have been Orange's first online order! Could not wait.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
That's the spirit!
Has anyone managed to add a UK city to the weather forecast page ? I found it almost impossible to scroll down to the last page, it keeps selecting wrong countries, the only way I see - scroll one-by-one using hardware buttons ....
Yes, I added 3. Scroll with finger, well, more of a flick.
evilskanker said:
Yes, I added 3. Scroll with finger, well, more of a flick.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I think I've tried about 20 different ways of scrolling with a finger, always end up with a list of south american cities ... (
Comparing to my old Orbit, I would say I have to press harder for screen to react ..
hertc said:
I think I've tried about 20 different ways of scrolling with a finger, always end up with a list of south american cities ... (
Comparing to my old Orbit, I would say I have to press harder for screen to react ..
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
It's at times like these that it would be good to be able to use the wheel for scrolling down.
evilskanker said:
It's at times like these that it would be good to be able to use the wheel for scrolling down.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Agree, still remember Sony J7 I had long time ago, all these things were so easy with a wheel ..
hertc said:
Comparing to my old Orbit, I would say I have to press harder for screen to react ..
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Apparently the Diamond is the first PocketPC device to have a tempered glass screen to make it extra tough. This makes it require a little more pressure than other devices.
But much more resilient to damage, and also nicer on the eye.
wasn't to amazed with the stock rom,
but after some days of usage and flashing the first cooked rom,
i am getting more and more into my new mobile..
Totally agree, using my Diamond for a week after three years on I-mate's.
carlosp_uk said:
CALLING PEOPLE
I feel that, action-wise, some things have (incredibly) got HARDER since my HTC Touch. For example, I used to be able to call my favourite contacts with a swipe and a tap.. ..now it's a swipe, a complicated side-swipey thing, a painstaking wait for the piccies to flip around, and finally a tap. Er, hello? This is the MAIN THING I USE THE PHONE FOR - CALLING PEOPLE! I can't even position my favourite contacts in memorable places;
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Just a suggestion -
Speed Dialing.
you can place at least SOME off your favorites in the positions you want.. and then it will just be one long press.. and it will dial.
Phone - menu - Speed Dial.
and of course.. there is always voice dialing.
Turn off TF3D. Ive heard is does HUGE things for the interface speed, and you'll get your tasks back (first thing Im going to do when I get a sprint diamond on this side of the pond)
I agree on almost every point
Not having used touch before, I really can't say anything bad about the navigation. To me it's a revolution, but it's not quite there yet.
The biggest flaw is the biggest asset. Let me explain.
The biggest asset to this device is the screen. I have never liked the screen on any of the QVGA devices I have used (Wizard and Hermes). The VGA screen on the Diamond is fantastic! Crisp and easy to read, even in direct sunlight. The words by HTC "Not too big, not too small" really sums up my feelings about it. However. Screen size is relative to what you display on it. I'm sure a lot of research, testing and effort went in to decide the size of the elements on the TF3D interface. Personally I would have designed it differently.
The main professional reason I choose to use a WiMo is Active Sync OTA (Over-The-Air). Having direct push of Mail, Calendar and Contacts to my device is critical in my profession. This HAS to work, it has to be easy to use, and easy to read. On the Diamond it works fantastically. Lots better than on the Hermes. It takes some getting used to, when you have never used touchflo before.
The touch interface has to be finger friendly, demanding finger sized icons and buttons. Having a small screen required HTC to use the entire screen. That makes you wish for a larger screen, yet a larger screen would require a larger device and I dont want that. Dilemma.
Like you said, the TF3D interface lacks in visual feedback. This could be replaced by tactile feedback. The same technology used in the game TEETER could be used to give me feedback on my actions.
Being a WiMo certified pro I know that the main obstacle for HTC is WiMo itself, or rather the Windows CE it is built upon. Win CE 5 is nowhere near a realtime OS and the switch to Win CE 6 (afaik it will be the foundation for WiMo 7) will be a major leap. CE6 is not a RTOS either, but it has the means to enable truly great applications. I look forward to what Developers will create for WiMo7.
(http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Windows_Embedded_CE_6.0)
The only thing I really dislike on my Diamond is the scrollwheel. I clearly does not work like you would expect it to. Unintuitive. And the Up/Down/Left/Right navigation around it is near unusable. Using the touch screen works though so it is not a showstopper for me.
Speed of the interface is good once you have used the cache size tweaks. Not great but good.
I fully agree on the speed comment, 527mhz... but it seems it's different mhz compared to my HTC Herald (P4350).
On my Herald I also have WM6.1, a 200mhz cpu (o'ced to 240 mhz) and everything starts faster!
I've got the 1.37.xxx.3 rom on my Diamond, TF3D disabled and still it's slower.
Very strange indeed.
guys i suggest you all to flash duttythroy's diamond project v2 rom. it increased the usability amazingly.
guys i suggest you all to flash duttythroy's diamond project v2 rom. it increased the usability amazingly. and c'mon guys, our shiny precioussssssss is out some weeks. look what they've done with the kaiser within one year... stay patient and keep being excited for that genius piece of hardware.
carlosp_uk said:
These are the first impressions of a power user after a week with the Diamond - I hope they might help others to decide whether to get one.
Background
I'm a power user but also a heavy day-to-day user as well. I use my phone for calling people, basic PDA functions, OTA google sync, web access, IMAP mail, GPS and also .NET software development. (I'm the author of 'Touch Settings') I used to have an HTC Touch. Before that, an HTC Prophet. Before that, an HTC MDA Compact.. ..you get the idea. I like HTC devices. I've stuck with them all, put up with their frustrations and watched them steadily improve. But this phone felt like the most exciting release yet. A massive leap forward in terms of specs. I was calling up Orange for about a month to find out the ETA. I actually RAN to the Orange Shop in Oxford Street and managed to get their last one in stock at the weekend!
So, one week in, here we go...
Great things
THE SCREEN
My favourite thing is the VGA screen. I cannot believe the difference it makes to the look of the phone, seriously. I could never go back to QVGA again now, this is a major improvement. Just reading the operator name in a slim, Arial-Narrow type font at the top of the screen and not being able to see the individual pixels, this is a true step forward. Everything, repeat, EVERYTHING looks better.
THE CAMERA
The auto-focus camera is nothing short of brilliant. Still rubbish in low-light levels, still no flash, but this is light-years ahead of the last one! I still get a little smirk of delight on my face when I hear it whirring as it focuses ahead of taking a picture!
A FASTER PROCESSOR
Hooray! FINALLY!... 528MHz ...4 times faster than my HTC Touch!...in theory. See below.
THE NEW ADD-ONS
Having GPS, FM radio, a tilt switch, a light sensor and more is fantastic. Teeter, the game, is awesome and will impress every person you know at a party.
THE SIZE
The Diamond is slightly smaller than the HTC Touch as well - easier to fit in a pocket. And it really does look gorgeous. Well done HTC.
Enough praise. Because then there's all this:
The Not-so-great things:
THE SPEED
Pop Quiz. Take your Windows Mobile phone. Tap the start button. Then tap 'Programs'. Does the window flash onto your screen immediately? No. There's a delay, isn't there? And sometimes you can even see it drawing every individual icon, top-to-bottom. On my HTC Touch, after a day of use, this took about 2 seconds.
On the Diamond, with TouchFlo 3D running, it's worse.
Skip this paragraph if you don't want a rant. Seriously, when are Windows Mobile phones actually going to get responsive enough to be useable? Delays when you press buttons, delays when you bring up menus, switch applications, etc, etc. What the hell is this operating system DOING with those 537 mega cycles per second??? Having patiently waited through my last THREE sloooow devices, I was thrilled at the thought of a phone that actually whizzed along... ...but it's a bit like going from XP on a slow computer to Vista on a fast computer - no noticable increase in speed at all. Such a crushing disappointment. My old Nokia could re-draw a screen faster 3 years ago. In this day and age, and with a processor doing a belting 500+ MHz, this should NOT be happening. Things should appear INSTANTLY and react the VERY MOMENT you touch them. I am running out of patience. The iPhone is looking more attactive every day.
TFL3D - INTERFACE
Fantastic to look at, but surprisngly sluggish to use. The more days that pass, the more it's becoming apparent that this interface is more about form and less about function. It's also often lacking in visual feedback; sometimes a button will move when you drag it (main nav bar at the bottom), sometimes not! You just have to swipe and see! Visual feedback is a very important part of user interface design.
COMMON ACTIONS, E.G. CALLING PEOPLE
I feel that, action-wise, some things have (incredibly) got HARDER since my HTC Touch. For example, I used to be able to call my favourite contacts with a swipe and a tap.. ..now it's a swipe, a complicated side-swipey thing, a painstaking wait for the piccies to flip around, and finally a tap. Er, hello? This is the MAIN THING I USE THE PHONE FOR - CALLING PEOPLE! I can't even position my favourite contacts in memorable places; again, a big factor in user interface design, hence why you remember where your icons are on your PC's desktop.
HOME SCREEN (TFL3D again really)
I can't add any custom home screen items! What the hell happened to being able to view my list of things to do? (tasks) Seriously, this is a shockingly bad step back. I know there are some apps to work around this, but I'm doing a review of the stock phone and software here.
THE JOYPAD
This should be renamed the joy-less pad. It's virtually impossible to click the Left and Right buttons without frequently mis-tapping and hitting the 'Back' or 'Hang Up' keys instead. There are no markings, you just sort of have to 'guess' where abouts on the flat screen to tap. The actual target area isn't big enough and I'm getting sick of quitting out of screens when I just want to move right or left. I've got fairly big hands but I'm no elephant.
The ipod-style 'whiz-around' wheel seems promising but when you try it, it's under-responsive and jerky in its movements. I would suggest that's why they've limited the applications that support it by default.
NO MINI SD CARD SLOT
Another step back - from 8Gb storage on my HTC Touch (with a mini SD card) to a paltry 4Gb now. Not enough to put all my music on the phone plus nav software, and no slot for more storage.
GROSS GREASINESS
As other forum users have pointed out, all that swiping on this shiny black device - it looks like the back of a transit van after a minute or so of use.
CONCLUSION
Owning an HTC Diamond is without doubt a step forward from an HTC Touch, but it's a smaller step than you might think. Be prepared for a mixed bag of emotions. Joy at the look of the thing, disappointment when you realise it's slower than you hoped, shouts of happiness when you first play 'Teeter', cries of frustration when the screen turns off randomly during calls or you miss-hit the joypad button or you can't swipe the tiny bit of the screen you're meant to.
After all that, I might surprise you by saying this. I would still say this phone is the best option on the market for the day-to-day user who wants an ultra-portable device that packs enough power to do that bit more than just making calls.
Just 24 hours into owning the phone I did my first ROM flash, from 1.37...1 to 1.37...3 - and this helped the speed somewhat and fixed a memory leak. I also tweaked the registry as much as I could. This has helped too, but the above problems are all still too evident, nothing has really improved enough to make me retract any of them. Keep watching these forums, though, because future ROM updates have the power to make this device much, much better.
That's about it, I hope these comments have helped, or given you something to debate in the space below. I'm going to stick with the Diamond for now. But I wouldn't mind betting I'll have completely disabled TouchFlo 3D before the week is out...
Carlos
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
what a crap...
THE SPEED
Put one of the new ROMs on it (Dutty, Walshieau), runs like hell. No delay here!
TFL3D - INTERFACE
Simply switch TF3D off if you don't like it.
And use an existing tool for your today (SPB Mobile Shell ect.).
COMMON ACTIONS, E.G. CALLING PEOPLE
Disable the Diamond dialer, you get your traditional dialer back.
HOME SCREEN (TFL3D again really)
Simply switch TF3D off.
Use an existing tool for today (SPB Mobile Shell ect.).
THE JOYPAD
Get used to it, it works perfect after a few weeks.
NO MINI SD CARD SLOT
Ok, maybe you got a point...
On the other hand: do you really need ALL your music all the time. A sync now and then for other music isn't that hard.
GROSS GREASINESS
Ok, the shiny cover gets greasy. But is't so beautiful,,,
Im sure a fair number of you will have experienced the same thing where you press a key once and you get like 3 of that letter and sometimes for me the Fn key doesnt work too well either
i've tried like swirling the keys around to move dust etc but it didnt help
maybe i should just send it back? becuase its really annoying
I also have this problem sometimes. Thought it might be a software problem or so, but maybe you are right and particles are collecting there.
Did someone try that on X1?
Well, if there was such a solution I wouldn't have to send my X1 to the service centre. And just delaying it as much as possible, but given that my warranty ends next week, I'd probably have to go down soon. And anyway, it's not just repeats that I'm facing. Sometimes it's the other way round, as in the keyboard not responding unless I press the key down real hard.
Mopral said:
Did someone try that on X1?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
just tried, and seems to work! thanks
settings-personal-buttons-up/down control
delay before first repeat set to long
repeat rate 3 from fast
works good!
I'd say it works about 80-90%. It does save the X1 from the trash piles, so kudos to the friendly guy who dug up the solution, and no kudos to SE and/or MS who can't think of fine-tuning the keyboard settings before they ship a product that was $800-900 unlocked at launch.
Caveat and an inappropriate rant: I remember doing so much research, and everyone across so many different forums said a hardware keyboard is the way to go if you do a lot of texting. Not true. I find that hardware keyboards require a lot of efforts to press compared to a virtual keyboard, even worse if it's not spaciously laid out, and even worse if, unlike the X1, the positioning of the keys relative to each other is off.
Truth is I type even faster on an iPhone/ipod touch than an X1, without feeling like an RSI is coming on, and it's not because of predictive text entry. It's because my thumbs can use a lot less force on the keys. I believe most people still press way too hard on a touch screen trying to be control freaks.
So the keyboard may be 80-90% improved, but I've got my budget ready for an iPhone. And no more listening, no more being open to suggestions!
beingthere said:
Caveat and an inappropriate rant: I remember doing so much research, and everyone across so many different forums said a hardware keyboard is the way to go if you do a lot of texting. Not true. I find that hardware keyboards require a lot of efforts to press compared to a virtual keyboard, even worse if it's not spaciously laid out, and even worse if, unlike the X1, the positioning of the keys relative to each other is off.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Well, I don't want to live without h/w keyboard anymore. And I did a fast typing challenge against an iPhone and won. The guy who wrote on that iPhone was a real freak, had an iPhone since it came out and types really fast...but I love the h/w keyboard on the xperia. If it would not have this double-letter error I would love it even more...Now I'm going to fix it with the solution mentioned above. Thanks!
I just want to add one thing...
The reason I say the fix is 80-90%, is because I think CPU speed and/or power settings might contribute somewhat to the keyboard issue. Once last week, I had the phone plugged into AC, and the keyboard suddenly became free of issues, and responded properly to my typical typing efforts.
Using nueCPL-ClockSpeed v1.3 in an unscientific test, the keyboard produces more mistakes on a lower speed (384MHz), but its Max Performance setting didn't exactly reproduce the AC power remedy.
This is not a very stringent observation at all, but since I am stuck with the X1 for a while, I'll keep on trying I'm betting that the next iPhone will be a significant update, so I have to hold off the purchase for now... and kiss NRGZ28's toes for his rom's.
Sapa13 said:
just tried, and seems to work! thanks
settings-personal-buttons-up/down control
delay before first repeat set to long
repeat rate 3 from fast
works good!
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
for two days, since i set this way, not even one double or missed letter!
i've done everything you've all said but it doesnt work does that mean it is a physical problem?
comeradealexi said:
i've done everything you've all said but it doesnt work does that mean it is a physical problem?
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Click to collapse
really dont know, since i set that way no problem at all.. maybe dirt came under your keyboard
I've been obsessing over the N1 since launch. Android is super neat, and unlocked phones rock. The only thing that really held me back from the purchase was the multitouch issue. I could easily see having to reset my screen with a lock cycle would drive me crazy. That said, I love the idea of the N1, and wish to escape my iPhone prison.
I recently purchased a Galaxy S phone, but am annoyed by the lack of support (saw this coming) and non-functioning locational services. The GPS and Compass are totally and utterly busted. Sadly, Google stopped selling the N1 on the day I decided to order one. However, I have been given a second chance, by purchasing the dev phone (which I am now considering).
So, let's make this like ripping off a bandage. Have mercy, internet. I have questions that require honest answers. I'm sorry if you've heard it all before, but this kind of information is annoyingly hard to dig up. Lightning Round, Go!:
Is the multitouch problem with the N1 (inverse axis swapping when two points cross) still present with 2.2?
Do any custom ROMs, apps or tweaks solve this issue? I read that the Moto Droid had a software setting ticked that allows proper multitouch (a sort of software hack), that google had not opted to enable by default? Sounds a bit silly to me, but what's the deal?
Does your screen still lose track of your fingers (inputing the wrong characters on the keyboard), causing you to lock cycle your screen to reset the digitizer?
Are the touch-buttons difficult to use?
A fellow N1 owner I met told me that his phone showed no signs of the multitouch 'bug', when using 'Multitouch Vis Test'. He said he was running the Modaco ROM. Is it true that something in this ROM fixes the multitouch problem?
Thank you, Princes of Internet.
Personally i dont experience any multitouch issues on my n1. Im running stock froyo 2.2. I have only had to re-lock my screen once and it never happened again. The capicative buttons below the screen take a bit of time to get used to at first it might take you a couple of tries to register a click but a few hours of use you get the hang of it.
Sent from my Nexus One using XDA App
Thanks for the reply.
Would you mind taking the 'Multitouch Vis Test' app for a spin, to see if the problem is gone, or if you just don't notice it?
If the issue is gone, would you mind making a youtube vid of it?
The multitouch on the n1 will not be "fixed" unless google/htc decided to use different hardware. If you can live with a device that can only do pinch to zoom, but not true multitouch, then the n1 is fine.
Honestly at this point, I'd hold off until you see the rest of HTC's lineup that's coming up before december.
Jon C said:
Is the multitouch problem with the N1 (inverse axis swapping when two points cross) still present with 2.2?
Do any custom ROMs, apps or tweaks solve this issue? I read that the Moto Droid had a software setting ticked that allows proper multitouch (a sort of software hack), that google had not opted to enable by default? Sounds a bit silly to me, but what's the deal?
Does your screen still lose track of your fingers (inputing the wrong characters on the keyboard), causing you to lock cycle your screen to reset the digitizer?
Are the touch-buttons difficult to use?
A fellow N1 owner I met told me that his phone showed no signs of the multitouch 'bug', when using 'Multitouch Vis Test'. He said he was running the Modaco ROM. Is it true that something in this ROM fixes the multitouch problem?
Thank you, Princes of Internet.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
1) It was possibly noticable in 2.1, in 2.2 in months now I havn't see it once. You can see with the visualiser you really have to know how to force it to get it to go, its just not something which will occur with correct commands you'll be doing.
2) Its down to the hardware, I'm not aware of any custom ROMs which have anything/anything significant.
3) The only time I EVER get this is with beta super bundles of ROMs, which is either the fault of the ROM, something going skitz in dalvic, how I installed it, or just a self generating bug. All of which are easily fixable. However if you were to stay with stock or more tested ROMs, you'd literally never see this.
4) For me they just work, at the start yes they wouldnt act the same a touch screen, but now they'll act like I want maybe 99% of the time. Sure friends using it to start with have to get used to it, but its not 'broken' if you will. The only thing I will mention is if your using it in weird orientations, there is a chance of hitting the buttons [mainly search] without meaning to with parts of your hand.
5) Again, this problem ONLY shows up if you know how to 'break' it. With 2.2+ its really hard to do it if you handed the phone to someone who's never used it before, because also again you wont be doing any commands which would conflict with the limitations, so you have to be misusing it in the first place to get the bug.
JCopernicus said:
Honestly at this point, I'd hold off until you see the rest of HTC's lineup that's coming up before december.
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Click to collapse
Agree with this.
Multitouch is completely crap on the n1. I loved it otherwise, yes every now and again it goes wack and registers the wrong thing... the capacitive buttons also suck and are hard to get used to... on Multitouch test its wacky and registers the wrong finger and won't register more than 2...
Great device, but galaxy is better.. I don't have any gps issues so can't complain about that.
No. No roms will fix the Multitouch issue. Nor make it any better.. if your into gaming with controls on the same axis forget about it, if ya want Multitouch keyboard forget about it...
I still have yet to ever experience the actual axis switch issue using this phone in real world. Sure the issue exists, but it just doesn't effect a single thing unless you use a certain game. But even that works fine, watch YouTube videos showing emulators on the nexus.
The point is, if you're looking for a reason to not get the nexus, The axis switch issue is not the reason that should sway your decision.
I recently came from an iPhone and I haven't noticed any difference in the multi-touch screen (except maybe in the typing on occasion, which I just attributed to my big fingers). I'd say for a good 95%+ of what you would do on the phone you can't tell any difference between the iPhone or N1 multitouch.
With the touch buttons on the bottom of the screen... Sometimes I hit one while typing, which takes me back to the home screen, but since the N1 has true multitasking all I have to do is reopen the app. A minor inconvenience. Or I could just type in landscape mode and not have any trouble at all.
RogerPodacter said:
I still have yet to ever experience the actual axis switch issue using this phone in real world. Sure the issue exists, but it just doesn't effect a single thing unless you use a certain game. But even that works fine, watch YouTube videos showing emulators on the nexus.
The point is, if you're looking for a reason to not get the nexus, The axis switch issue is not the reason that should sway your decision.
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Click to collapse
Games like toonWarz or nova will mess up. Has the controls on bottom right and shooting on bottom right. So when your running using the left controls and shoot real quick with the right, it'll now wig out and keep shooting even when you let go and the dude will walk a different way be cause now the sensor thinks your touching in a different spot..
Now you can let go of the left finger then shoot but when ya need precision in some shooting games you will be dead if you do that....
Pinch to zoom is fine and emulators with controls on the top and bottom vs just the bottom ( same axis), but for games like nova, heavy gunner, modern combat, ps1 emulator (unless it has opposite axis controls) which mine don't, took Warz, etc. It will not work properly ....
smashpunks said:
Games like toonWarz or nova will mess up. Has the controls on bottom right and shooting on bottom right. So when your running using the left controls and shoot real quick with the right, it'll now wig out and keep shooting even when you let go and the dude will walk a different way be cause now the sensor thinks your touching in a different spot..
Now you can let go of the left finger then shoot but when ya need precision in some shooting games you will be dead if you do that....
Pinch to zoom is fine and emulators with controls on the top and bottom vs just the bottom ( same axis), but for games like nova, heavy gunner, modern combat, ps1 emulator (unless it has opposite axis controls) which mine don't, took Warz, etc. It will not work properly ....
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
this is a good explanation of what is effected. if you're a big gamer then consider it, but things like pinch to zoom in the browser, maps, pics, works just as great as ever.
Thanks for the feedback, guys.
Coming from the Galaxy S, I imagine I will miss a few things. One of them being: media playback and overall storage.
I guess with the N1, I'd need to find a non-bootlegged 32GB microSD card. But my other question would be: is there an easy way to play all of the content that the Galaxy S can handle, or is the GPU in the Samsung phone so much better that the N1 can't keep up?
I really like that about the SGS: I just drop movies (mp4, xvid, divx and so forth) onto the internal ROM and they play without issue. Media capabilities are very nice.
Does the N1 play lots of videos like this out of the box? If not, is there a decent media application?
Also, about HTC's other devices: I'd love to wait, but I'm worried that the newer phones won't have nice accessories. The N1 has that awesome car dock, that I would use all of the time. The SGS doesn't have any accessories like that, and it makes me sad. Most of HTC's N1 follow-up lacked similar docks and cradles.
If I return this SGS (likely), I will probably be jumping to the N1, just for that 'official' feel of it (very sturdy, solid first-party accessories).
You have no idea how sad I was, when Google announced they were giving up on creating their own phones. Hate them all you want: but Apple really has that system (solid build, quality integration / lack of fragmentation) nailed. I was really hoping that Google could bring that unification to Android with their own branded devices.
Loving Android, though. Never going back to iOS.
Anyone saying the n1 doesn't suffer from multitouch issues is sadly mistaken. The one thing that bugs me about the n1 is the touch screen issue. You won't be able to play games like nova, or certain games on emulators (when using dpad plus buttons that are at the same level it has issues) and it does have issues when crossing the axises.
mjm128 said:
Anyone saying the n1 doesn't suffer from multitouch issues is sadly mistaken. The one thing that bugs me about the n1 is the touch screen issue. You won't be able to play games like nova, or certain games on emulators (when using dpad plus buttons that are at the same level it has issues) and it does have issues when crossing the axises.
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Click to collapse
everyone said the issue exists it just doesnt show up unless you...play....games. otherwise its a non issue.
The N1's touchscreen is totaly crap. There is a thread about touchscreen issues at oficial forum. It has more than 2000 posts explaning all problems of nexus one touchscreen. Check it out.
Sent from my Nexus One using XDA App
Jon C said:
Thanks for the feedback, guys.
Coming from the Galaxy S, I imagine I will miss a few things. One of them being: media playback and overall storage.
I guess with the N1, I'd need to find a non-bootlegged 32GB microSD card. But my other question would be: is there an easy way to play all of the content that the Galaxy S can handle, or is the GPU in the Samsung phone so much better that the N1 can't keep up?
I really like that about the SGS: I just drop movies (mp4, xvid, divx and so forth) onto the internal ROM and they play without issue. Media capabilities are very nice.
Does the N1 play lots of videos like this out of the box? If not, is there a decent media application?
Also, about HTC's other devices: I'd love to wait, but I'm worried that the newer phones won't have nice accessories. The N1 has that awesome car dock, that I would use all of the time. The SGS doesn't have any accessories like that, and it makes me sad. Most of HTC's N1 follow-up lacked similar docks and cradles.
If I return this SGS (likely), I will probably be jumping to the N1, just for that 'official' feel of it (very sturdy, solid first-party accessories).
You have no idea how sad I was, when Google announced they were giving up on creating their own phones. Hate them all you want: but Apple really has that system (solid build, quality integration / lack of fragmentation) nailed. I was really hoping that Google could bring that unification to Android with their own branded devices.
Loving Android, though. Never going back to iOS.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
The gpu is OK. But definitely a lot less powerful than the sgs, you will notice in movies, live wallpapers and especially games... there's a decent video player called rockplayer that plays a lot of stuff like avi and xvid , but its not ad good as the sgs player ...
Put it this way, either stay sgs and have a not so well navigation but awesome everything elsex or go nexus with good GPS but a old touch sensor that will hardly recognize both fingers on anything other than pinch to zoom.....
The only real world scenario i have encountered the axis switch is when you do a pinch on an album in the gallery to have it flick through them, it switches often when doing that.
Nexus One multi-touch sucks for games. I've tried some fancy gameloft games that req two fingers on screen, or PS & gameboy emulators that req this and it drives me insane. Can be so frustrating for gaming and is the only thing that I find a let down for this device. I wish I knew before I purchased it because the gaming although not the only thing I brought it for is something that I thought would be cool on my phone.
Simply put, don't get the N1 if mobile gaming is important to you. I'm not talking about simple single tap games, but the intricate ones (PSX Emu, EA Sports, Gamesloft, etc). If you could live without it, the touchscreen is fine for regular day to day use.
Or just root and carry your favorite bluetooth game controller. I have a mini bt keyboard that works great for emulators
So I was messing around with the bluetooth on my coworker's 7 this morning and paired it with my Apple BT trackpad. Much to my surprise it showed up with 10+ point multi-touch support (tested in markers app)
it doesnt appear that the touch radius stuff is supported, but its still kinda interesting.
For comparison on my DZ running ICS i get a cursor and you can click but thats about it.
Interesting, does the N7 it's self support 10 touches? That is very impressive to me. I love when the amount of touch data a screen can handle greatly exceeds what is necessary. That means it won't ever be a problem.
Take screens for example, if the max the human eye can see is 300 dpi. Just make all screens at least 600 and we will never have screen issues again. Well...Resolution wise XD
But serious, were you able to control the N7 with that thing?
Locklear308 said:
I love when the amount of touch data a screen can handle greatly exceeds what is necessary. That means it won't ever be a problem.
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Until we evolve an extra finger on each hand, or use our nose/other body parts to click stuff!
yeah, its actually pretty intuitive to control using the external pad. its not quite as natural as touching the actual screen, but i could see it working for something like a presentation or app demo where you didnt want to obstruct the view.
amusingly it crashes markers with 12 touches (i think the trackpad supports ~50 but i may be wrong)
I can only test 10 at the moment but the internal touch hardware does handle at least 10.