So what do you guys think?
I'm still puzzled by how Google can sell basically the same phone as the Optimus G for half the price.
Benchmarks show heat issues with the N4 and very low heat tolerances before the CPU/GPU starts throttling massively cutting performance basically in half.
So maybe when Google approached LG to build the N4 and told them they need to sell it for $299 off contract, LG was like..,"hmmm.. we do have a bunch of rejected bin parts from the Optimus G we could sell for half price. Deal, we'll build the N4 for $299 Cha-Ching!!$!"
Manufacturers bin parts all the time, Intel, Nvidia ect. bin their CPU's and GPU's and basically put the rejected ones in lower end models and downclocks them.
LG makes some amazing IPS $1000 panels for Apple and Dell, the ones that don't cut it get sold for basically nothing and put into cheaper non-brand name cases (Yamakasi,Acheiva ect) and sold for $300.
Makes me think that maybe LG is doing the same with the N4 line up. What do you guys think? These thermal issues the N4 is facing is pointing me in that direction. Lower bin parts.
No
Sent from my Galaxy Nexus using xda app-developers app
Interesting approach. But Google would go nuts if LG would so something like that. I can't really give an educated answer but I personally don't think they do. Just a feeling.
Dan37tz said:
So what do you guys think?
I'm still puzzled by how Google can sell basically the same phone as the Optimus G for half the price.
Benchmarks show heat issues with the N4 and very low heat tolerances before the CPU/GPU starts throttling massively cutting performance basically in half.
So maybe when Google approached LG to build the N4 and told them they need to sell it for $299 off contract, LG was like..,"hmmm.. we do have a bunch of rejected bin parts from the Optimus G we could sell for half price. Deal, we'll build the N4 for $299 Cha-Ching!!$!"
Manufacturers bin parts all the time, Intel, Nvidia ect. bin their CPU's and GPU's and basically put the rejected ones in lower end models and downclocks them.
LG makes some amazing IPS $1000 panels for Apple and Dell, the ones that don't cut it get sold for basically nothing and put into cheaper non-brand name cases (Yamakasi,Acheiva ect) and sold for $300.
Makes me think that maybe LG is doing the same with the N4 line up. What do you guys think? These thermal issues the N4 is facing is pointing me in that direction. Lower bin parts.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
It is very possible and happen a lot in computer world.
But we can't know for sure. Both LG and Google won't say anything about this.
It costs apple like $166 to make an iPhone..google is making money..believe it.The markup is insane on phones..
Sent from my Nexus 7 using xda app-developers app
Dan37tz said:
So what do you guys think?
I'm still puzzled by how Google can sell basically the same phone as the Optimus G for half the price.
Benchmarks show heat issues with the N4 and very low heat tolerances before the CPU/GPU starts throttling massively cutting performance basically in half.
So maybe when Google approached LG to build the N4 and told them they need to sell it for $299 off contract, LG was like..,"hmmm.. we do have a bunch of rejected bin parts from the Optimus G we could sell for half price. Deal, we'll build the N4 for $299 Cha-Ching!!$!"
Manufacturers bin parts all the time, Intel, Nvidia ect. bin their CPU's and GPU's and basically put the rejected ones in lower end models and downclocks them.
LG makes some amazing IPS $1000 panels for Apple and Dell, the ones that don't cut it get sold for basically nothing and put into cheaper non-brand name cases (Yamakasi,Acheiva ect) and sold for $300.
Makes me think that maybe LG is doing the same with the N4 line up. What do you guys think? These thermal issues the N4 is facing is pointing me in that direction. Lower bin parts.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Unlikely tbh. Good comspiracy thogh I think google subsidizes it to sell it almost above cost. LG doesn't, thus non play countries are screwed. EU wouldn't allow them to sell it at cost or below so the 8GB is slightly above cost, and they know that many people won't buy that, so the 16GB is all profit.
Dan37tz said:
So what do you guys think?
I'm still puzzled by how Google can sell basically the same phone as the Optimus G for half the price.
Benchmarks show heat issues with the N4 and very low heat tolerances before the CPU/GPU starts throttling massively cutting performance basically in half.
So maybe when Google approached LG to build the N4 and told them they need to sell it for $299 off contract, LG was like..,"hmmm.. we do have a bunch of rejected bin parts from the Optimus G we could sell for half price. Deal, we'll build the N4 for $299 Cha-Ching!!$!"
Manufacturers bin parts all the time, Intel, Nvidia ect. bin their CPU's and GPU's and basically put the rejected ones in lower end models and downclocks them.
LG makes some amazing IPS $1000 panels for Apple and Dell, the ones that don't cut it get sold for basically nothing and put into cheaper non-brand name cases (Yamakasi,Acheiva ect) and sold for $300.
Makes me think that maybe LG is doing the same with the N4 line up. What do you guys think? These thermal issues the N4 is facing is pointing me in that direction. Lower bin parts.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Ah stop this kind of conspiracy. Say it when you have some proof.
Richieboy67 said:
It costs apple like $166 to make an iPhone..google is making money..believe it.The markup is insane on phones..
Sent from my Nexus 7 using xda app-developers app
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
this
+ selling it for a lower price means selling more. More sold devices result in more money through play store (apps, music, books, movies...)
Another dumb conspiracy theory.
Mods, we need a "dumb conspiracy theories because I wasn't able to get one" thread to consolidate these into.
If this were the case, you know warranty returns and repairs and everything else would drive up the cost for both LG and Google, no?
Richieboy67 said:
It costs apple like $166 to make an iPhone..google is making money..believe it.The markup is insane on phones..
Sent from my Nexus 7 using xda app-developers app
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Not to mention the cost of brick and mortar stores as well as the amount of advertising that Apple does vs what Google does for the Nexus devices. Adding more advanced technology, like LTE radios and microSD readers will also mean higher costs (perhaps not a huge amount, but additional costs, none the less).
Google is in the search business, ad business and by getting people onto their phones they are also getting people into the google eco system its like apple believe it or not, people buy into it because they like the product at first but before they know it all their music is on itunes and they are buying apps from the app store all making apple money. Same applies there isnt much you can do on an android phone without making google money one way or another. either from the ads displayed or searches completed then there is play music which is aggressively priced for digital download. coincidence. no they want you locked into all things google. So by subing the phone initially they will predict the revenue made through other means will counter that,
so no it is not made from reject parts
also why would LG even care if this is successful. They make the same amount per handset as selling directly to distributors just google is acting as the distributor and lowering the price by subsidising it.
If i was a manufacturer like LG i would hope it sold in its millions as it would make me as a manufacturer some quick cash that I can then pump back into future R&D and manufacturing processes meaning it can compete better on par with its rivals
Simple really
hbkmog said:
Ah stop this kind of conspiracy. Say it when you have some proof.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Well I'm still kind of lost why the performance of this device suffers so much compared to other phones with the same chipset.
Hell for example the newly introducted HTC DNA which uses the identical chipset S4 pro, is pulling in over 8000 in quadrant! It's also pushing a 1080p screen with 440ppi!!!
Then we have the N4 here, with much less pixels to tax the GPU/CPU and it's pulling in 4000 Quadrants. There is something majorly wrong here.
I don't think it's the design of the phone, the N4 is not a super thin lightweight device. It's pretty thick so there should be plenty of room inside for heat dissipation.
I also don't think it has anything to do with software, the DNA is running 4.1 Jellybean, with a whole bunch of Verizon crap on it.
The N4 is running 4.2 Pure Jellybean, which is basically the same just with a couple camera tricks, a new keyboard and no crapware to slow it down. It's a pure unaltered android software so if it really was just an issue with the kernal or rom, Google would have fixed it easily and immediately with the latest OTA. That OTA didn't do crap and it still suffers from the performance issues.
Makes me believe it's an actual problem with the chipset itself, a lower bin set.
its simply down to power management which others incorporate where as the N4 has not as its not a feature baked into android. However devs will come up with these options as add ons and you will see where you can tweek the processor
Nope nope nope
ok the thing is these phones are about $700 with no sub from carrier. google is shelling out about $380 a unit for the phone to be sold at the price they are being sold for $299 and $349us or $309 or $359 cnd. that price is subsidize by google. so to answer the question of OP no its not cheaper parts for the cheaper phone! the part for the phone is still the same cost it just google will be making their money back on ads and playstore purchase and also google drive upgrades.. I mean $380 a unit is a lot but if google is truly the ad's king they will rake in the dough from all the revenue of that which would mean peanuts for $380 a phone!
xdviper said:
If this were the case, you know warranty returns and repairs and everything else would drive up the cost for both LG and Google, no?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
The thing is Google never advertised that the N4 should achieve a certain score on a benchmark. As far as they're concern, as long as the device runs their software smoothly, it doesn't matter what the benchmarks say.
Alicklee said:
ok the thing is these phones are about $700 with no sub from carrier. google is shelling out about $380 a unit for the phone to be sold at the price they are being sold for $299 and $349us or $309 or $359 cnd. that price is subsidize by google. so to answer the question of OP no its not cheaper parts for the cheaper phone! the part for the phone is still the same cost it just google will be making their money back on ads and playstore purchase and also google drive upgrades.. I mean $380 a unit is a lot but if google is truly the ad's king they will rake in the dough from all the revenue of that which would mean peanuts for $380 a phone!
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I would guess it costs them well under $200 for them to make this phone..the optimus also..
Sent from my Nexus 7 using xda app-developers app
This thread makes my head hurt. I gave it a 1 out of 5 stars because there is no option for 0 star. By this logic then I suggest you buy the LG Optimus G instead.
Google and T-Mobile get the device from LG. Google is selling the Nexus 4 for cheap because they have lots of money. T-Mobile is selling the Nexus 4 at $500 because they like to rip off people. The end.
do you even know what binning is or how it actually works?
I think LG of all companies wanted to do the Nexus because they wanted to gain a better smartphone manufacturer image. What better way to do this by doing a highly anticipated phone like this? Think of all the posts trashing LG about their phones (including me). I was so pissed when I found out. But the more I think about it, most of the issues I've had with LG phones have been software related. Hopefully with stock Android, the phone will regain the trust from the masses. But I highly doubt LG would make a crappy phone to try and rebuild their presence as a smartphone manufacturer.
Sent from my LT30at using xda app-developers app
Related
Google and LG most likely make NO money from selling the Nexus 4 at the $299 pricepoint. The Nexus 4 is identical to the Optimus G, which is suppose to be LG's cash cow. Same proc, same screen. Tbe build actually looks nicer on the Nexus 4. The camera is a wash since the 13MP one sucks and the 8MP is identical on both. So literally the only difference is whether you want LTE or not. Is LTE (and a subjectively much uglier design) worth $200+ price premium for the Optimus G? The Nexus 4 also has pure Android which is also a big plus, So why is LG releasing the (much better) Nexus 4 at a no-profit price and undercutting their cash cow the Optimus G? They are barely making squat right now in the mobile phone space. This makes no business sense.
I'm pretty sure LG just builds the phone and gets paid for it, Google probably will sell it close to what they paid to get it built. So LG isn't losing money, Google is just breaking even or maybe barely losing.
Sent from my Galaxy Nexus using xda premium
Improving their brand image while simultaneously getting their brand name out there?
While not entirely the same, you could argue that with the Galaxy Nexus, it was fighting with the S2 and a little bit of the S3.
Yet Samsung managed to really make their push during that time period. People have tons of horror stories when it comes to LG. If they play their cards right with these devices, they'll have a much brighter future.
Sent from my Transformer Prime TF201 using Xparent Cyan Tapatalk 2
The Xiaomi Mi2 will also be selling at a loss ($310 vs a cost of $370), and has pretty much identical specs as the Nexus 4. I think they can manage to break even overall, especially with most sales going to the 16 GB version.
florelui001p said:
I'm pretty sure LG just builds the phone and gets paid for it, Google probably will sell it close to what they paid to get it built. So LG isn't losing money, Google is just breaking even or maybe barely losing.
Sent from my Galaxy Nexus using xda premium
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
X2
Google pays for it, and then they sell it to us with expensive taxes via Google Play :B
I'm assuming LG developed the phone for a flat contract price to Google.
Google is likely making little to nothing on selling the price.
They are likely straight up buying marketshare for android and enticing people to buy into their ecosystem while they make money off apps, movies, tv shows, music, and ads.
datwunkid said:
I'm assuming LG developed the phone for a flat contract price to Google.
Google is likely making little to nothing on selling the price.
They are likely straight up buying marketshare for android and enticing people to buy into their ecosystem while they make money off apps, movies, tv shows, music, and ads.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
They sure are!
I will mostly likely be dropping the iPhone ecosystem for Android because of the Nexus 4 come November 13th. Eventually I will also convince others who rely on my smartphone knowledge on what to buy to get the Nexus 4. So it has done its job even if Google isn't making a profit off of the hardware. They will eventually make profit off of me from the Google Play content I (and many others I convince) purchase.
Excellent post datwunkid :good:
I think Google is taking the hit and selling it close to cost. You also have to factor in that the retail cost of some phones have carrier markup added in as well so that they can make some extra $$$ off people buying off contract. They're probably selling it close to cost and the Nexus line isn't really a big seller to begin with so nobody's really losing a boatload of money here. LG gets to have their name attached to what is looking to be an incredible Android phone (and DEAD SEXY!!!) which will get them back into the good graces of some of the Android fans out there. Also remember Google is an ad company - selling phones for profit isn't where they're making the lion's share of their money and while I'm sure they care somewhat about how well this device does, it'll barely have any effect on their bottom line.
Let's not kid ourselves. Google is definitely making money here. I know in the retail market, mark-up is routinely 1000%. I wouldn't be surprised one bit if LG can spit these phones out in mass production at $50 a unit or cheaper. Anybody that's had any experience in buying mass quantities knows that Google is making money.
When you see service providers selling phones out of contract for $600-$800, your seeing first hand the companies rape/screw the general public like they do best. Even when you buy a phone for a subsidized price from one of the big four, do you really think that are not still making money off the sale of the unit? Don't kid yourself...
giant22000 said:
Let's not kid ourselves. Google is definitely making money here. I know in the retail market, mark-up is routinely 1000%. I wouldn't be surprised one bit if LG can spit these phones out in mass production at $50 a unit or cheaper. Anybody that's had any experience in buying mass quantities knows that Google is making money.
When you see service providers selling phones out of contract for $600-$800, your seeing first hand the companies rape/screw the general public like they do best. Even when you buy a phone for a subsidized price from one of the big four, do you really think that are not still making money off the sale of the unit? Don't kid yourself...
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
You ever look at any tear downs of phones? The parts on this phone are probably worth two hundred or so dollars, plus assembly, warranty claims, marketing. There will be a thin margin, but it will be there. I don't think many carriers will pick up the phone, so it will only really appeal to people who avoid contracts, anyway.
Sent from my HTC Vision using xda app-developers app
It makes sense for LG to do it at little to no profit because releasing the phone would help their market and image in the long run if the phone is a success. Google is baking on the consumers to buy apps, books, music, and magazines from their store.
giant22000 said:
I wouldn't be surprised one bit if LG can spit these phones out in mass production at $50 a unit or cheaper.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Have you been drinking tonight by any chance? Your post has me curious :laugh:
Borteeo said:
You ever look at any tear downs of phones? The parts on this phone are probably worth two hundred or so dollars, plus assembly, warranty claims, marketing. There will be a thin margin, but it will be there. I don't think many carriers will pick up the phone, so it will only really appeal to people who avoid contracts, anyway.
Sent from my HTC Vision using xda app-developers app
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Think of it this way. When it comes to building a pc, you can't build one as cheap as you can buy one from one of the big boys. Plain and simple, they buy parts by the 1000's. These parts are heavily discounted at a contracted, negotiated price when bought this way.
I can assure that NO company is going to put forth the effort for a small profit margin. That's just how the corporate world works. If it doesn't make good/excellent profits, it's simply not worth the time or effort.
y would you complain about something like this though. the price is a good thing :good:
No complaining here! I'm totally stoked about it's price point. Best bang for the buck bar-none in my book! Can't wait to order...
I can assure that NO company is going to put forth the effort for a small profit margin. That's just how the corporate world works. If it doesn't make good/excellent profits, it's simply not worth the time or effort.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Still I disagree about $50, there are actual documented break down of iPhone 4S hardware cost, is around $180, though the 5 is cheaper. Give the chinese slaves a break.
Sent from my R800x
Well here is the news Google partnered with lg because of the price as they are the only one who agreed to make phone at this price level. Its also get back lg to the market, despite their products are cool but their developers are sucks, lazy people wouldnt work on old devices to bring latest os so people like me promised won't buy lg product ever again, other company like Sony and Samsung refused Google to make smartphone with this spec for this price. But who cares about the partner as long as Google controls the os. I'm getting this as soon as it goes live for sale.
Sent from my Galaxy Nexus using xda app-developers app
Maybe Samsung doesn't want to create any more nexus phone just because of this. Their Galaxy S line and Note line will be ruined.
The same thing happens with the nexus 10, which is cheaper and FAR more specwise than note 10.1
Sent from my GT-I9100 using Tapatalk 2
qreffie said:
I think Google is taking the hit and selling it close to cost.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
The iPhone 5 costs about 200$ (16gb I think). I don't think the Nexus will cost much more. So, Google will get money out of this
Google was earning money even with the 16gb a 249$
I you think it costs them that money to make a phone you are mistaken.
I have seen retail buy in prices for handsets in bulk, and those would raise your eye brows!
so manufacturing prices would be much less.
Can not for the life of me see how this phone is so cheap considering the specs and build quality. Anybody had any hands on experience with the phone find any flaws? If I get the money I'm almost definitely going to buy this. I just hope that the battery life and sound quality are decent as to me it just seems too cheap to be perfect. I also hate the snobbery from the iPhone users who have seen the price of this and think what a load of cheap garbage but I'd love for this to prove them wrong.
It's not that this phone is cheap, it's that unlocked phones are CRAZY overpriced.
There is no catch, Google wants to get consumers away from carrier control and push their Android ecosystem. Win/win for them.
sharpinator said:
Can not for the life of me see how this phone is so cheap considering the specs and build quality. Anybody had any hands on experience with the phone find any flaws? If I get the money I'm almost definitely going to buy this. I just hope that the battery life and sound quality are decent as to me it just seems too cheap to be perfect. I also hate the snobbery from the iPhone users who have seen the price of this and think what a load of cheap garbage but I'd love for this to prove them wrong.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Search Nexus 4 reviews on Google, I'm sure you bound to find many advantages and disadvantages. Biggest ones to concern me is the glass back breaks easily and that storage wise you only get 8GB or 16GB. Not having LTE isn't a problem since I'm with T-Mobile.
They are probably only barely breaking even on the costs; phones like the Galaxy S III and the iPhone 5 have a unit cost much lower than their retail cost. Gotta make money somehow. I'm not sure what Google's motivations are with setting these prices, but they're not making a profit from them.
DanielBeaver said:
I'm not sure what Google's motivations are with setting these prices, but they're not making a profit from them.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Probably pushing stock android and android development. Google isn't looking to get a profit on the phone, but they are looking to get a profit on what you do with the phone (aka: search).
DanielBeaver said:
They are probably only barely breaking even on the costs; phones like the Galaxy S III and the iPhone 5 have a unit cost much lower than their retail cost. Gotta make money somehow. I'm not sure what Google's motivations are with setting these prices, but they're not making a profit from them.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
That's very interesting Daniel. It kind of sounds like how Sony sold the ps3 at a much lower price than it should be sold. They were losing money to push blu ray so maybe google are selling a really "affordable" High end phone to push android that one step further than iPhone.
Its Google flexing a little, its all about market share so break even is fine. Im aliitle concerned about when motorola takes the lead, though that could be a year or two away. no complaints if they want to give me a break. Im on t-Mobile too so no big deal LTE.
The catch is they know you will buy apps. + you may be tempted to get one for other peeps in your life as they are cheap and its xmas time. These peeps, will also buy apps.
/shrug
GoreTan said:
Search Nexus 4 reviews on Google, I'm sure you bound to find many advantages and disadvantages. Biggest ones to concern me is the glass back breaks easily and that storage wise you only get 8GB or 16GB. Not having LTE isn't a problem since I'm with T-Mobile.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I suppose the glass breaking could be an issue but then again I treat my phones like the crown jewels so I doubt that would be a huge problem for me. Also being in the UK on three I get decent HSPA speeds so the lack of LTE or 4G is absolutely irrelevant to me and most of the UK. The faster phones processors are getting the faster web browsing is with 3g anyway so I'm not fussed for 4g at the moment.
Right, they want Android everywhere and this is how Android wins eventually..not to mention it costs them squat per phone to build..
Sent from my Nexus 7 using xda app-developers app
So it's a marketing ploy to really push android. I'm fine with that As long as they weren't sacrificing any quality with the phone. This is surely exciting. I hope I can get one as soon as possible. I'm a huge phone geek (well that's obvious being on XDA as we all are) and I've never seen anyone with a Nexus device in the UK so I think it will be great If people in the UK will start getting them. I've always been with sense so vanilla will be a completely new experience.
I came here immediately looking for posts that said that no LTE is the catch, didn't see any to my surprise
espionage724 said:
I came here immediately looking for posts that said that no LTE is the catch, didn't see any to my surprise
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
haha I'm so glad no one has said it. It barely matters to anyone outside of the US!
As great as this price is to get Android out into the world more, I just have a feeling that since the phone is only being sold on the play store for the (majority of people to buy) I am concerned that if they dont go all out on commercials (which they should of started with already IMO) then I have a feeling that they wont get many new people buying the phone.
sharpinator said:
Can not for the life of me see how this phone is so cheap considering the specs and build quality. Anybody had any hands on experience with the phone find any flaws? If I get the money I'm almost definitely going to buy this. I just hope that the battery life and sound quality are decent as to me it just seems too cheap to be perfect. I also hate the snobbery from the iPhone users who have seen the price of this and think what a load of cheap garbage but I'd love for this to prove them wrong.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Not sure there's a catch. I don't like the glass back. Seems like they're copying Apple. I also don't ;like how you can't remove the battery. They wear out after a while.
I hope hope hope that they improved the camera. When the Galaxy Nexus was released, it was promised that it took pictures instantly. This was an improvement from my older Androids which used to take 2-5 seconds to focus and snap a pic. However, the camera on the Galaxy Nexus was weak as hell. Grainy and blurry in low light and only 5 MP..
Most likely, Google is making a limited profit with this device because they just want to get it out there.
tweaked said:
The catch is they know you will buy apps. + you may be tempted to get one for other peeps in your life as they are cheap and its xmas time. These peeps, will also buy apps.
/shrug
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
That's what I'm thinking. I'm sure the bulk of their profit from Android is based on the play store. Lower the cost of phones, get them in to the hands of more people, and in turn the people buy more apps from the play store. There's their profit:thumbup:
Sent from my A100 using xda app-developers app
Cost for making an iPhone 5 is $389.XX. Read it in the Time magazine. This may answer the question.
Its not marketing.. its just how they do money. Google is the second most profitable company in the world. And now of that was accomplished by selling hardware. Selling hardware at cost that boosts their income method is the best way to stay in "what they best". Plus it has some perks like happy customers, injected competition and market confidence.
On the other side of the medal, you have apple, the most profitable company in the world, that makes their money on high margin.
Both ways are legit ways to make money, but me, personally I prefer the half priced one
No, catch. Like what others have posted Google wants people using their ecosystem.
I think its great they are pricing it at cost probably, I'm sure there is profit but very little. I'm tiredof carriers and manufacturers raping customers with their crazy markups.
I've never had my phone battery go bad on me. The battery is easily accessible via 2 screws on bottom of phone, no biggie.
LTE is not really a deal breaker for me, I'm in las Vegas and get 14mbps on T-mobiles faux G.
Sent from my Nexus 7 using Tapatalk 2
Am I the only one here thinking that it was part of google's plan to make it look like they sold a bunch of N4s in order to get the media's attention by bragging about how many they sold? Just Google: "nexus 4 sold out". You will find many websites reporting that nexus 4 are selling like hot cakes/or are sold out. I'm going to have to look at the next news paper, I bet we will see it in the headlines. This is wonderful news for Google. Great advertisement.
More over I would like to know what you guys think of this. Don't you think that such a rich company like Google would have for seen this?
Also the fact that the number of sold devices are not being reported, wouldn't that indicate that the amount of devices are actually not that much after all? (mentioning the # of sold units would discredit their bragging right? - Of course, only if it is not high)
Chances are they have a lot on stock but want to sell only a certain amount for the time being.
Now what would concern me is, if it actually is the truth that they ran out of supply. I mean, LG? There are few people who have faith in LG, their android update policy is enough to associate that company with incompetence.
Even with the nexus phone being an LG, they already managed to leave a bad impression in countries with no play store by announcing a price which could be nearly up to double the price of the nexus 4 in the play store.
What if LG is not able to keep up with demand? What is your say? What do you think is going on?
I visited a site that mentioned that Google has done this before, in order to see how high the demand is and to fulfill the needs a few days/weeks/month later. Was not following the galaxy nexus sale , anyone that experienced this here?
Hope this thread doesn't get closed, I could imagine some interesting discussion going on
no, just scumbags trying to make a profit by hogging all the stock
AznDud333 said:
no, just scumbags trying to make a profit by hogging all the stock
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I think it its engineered, why not Apple do it all the time
Naw, I mean, there really weren't any commercials over it or anything. Google has the money to spend on advertising for it, but they honestly didn't. I feel they just weren't too sure on when to do it themselves and that we were probably making more out of it than needed to be.
dahmmy said:
I think it its engineered, why not Apple do it all the time
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
google's site never lags
it lagged today.
It's a big global conspiracy to ruin your day. Mission accomplished.
If this was Apple then, yes, I would believe it was intentional but honestly the server was crashing. What I saw you can't fake. It was like a DDoS attack. That server was basically brought to its knees. SERIOUSLY.
Sent from my Nexus 7
Ravynmagi said:
It's a big global conspiracy to ruin your day. Mission accomplished.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
The Illuminati. Yes! They are watching us!
@above: hmmm. I prefer Lg is incompetent
I think it may be a combination of Google's lack of concern about their customers combined with a poor working relationship with LG. I don't think Google wants publicity about this launch because they and LG won't come off looking too good. Google must have thought it was getting more units from LG because they had indicated they would sell the Nexus 4 via Playstore in the Netherlands and Belgium. Then at the last minute, they had to cancel those commitments because they didn't get enough units from LG. At the same time, non-US carriers selling the phone at a much higher price than Google got units ahead of launch time so their customers could physically have the phone today. Hence, you have a number of users posting threads here about problems with their brand new Nexus 4 phones, which they have in hand. So, LG shorted Google to send phones to vendors that sell the Nexus 4 at a higher price. I suspect the whole sales cycle of this phone may be marked by problems between Google and LG, resulting in supply shortages for the lower priced Google-sold phones. If consumers want the phone and don't want to wait for weeks at a time between LG's periodic shipment of a meager supply to Google, you may be forced to buy from other vendors at a higher price or, in the US, a contract commitment to T-Mobile. It looks like Google + LG= oil + water; they don't mix well.
mke1973 said:
I think it may be a combination of Google's lack of concern about their customers combined with a poor working relationship with LG. I don't think Google wants publicity about this launch because they and LG won't come off looking too good. Google must have thought it was getting more units from LG because they had indicated they would sell the Nexus 4 via Playstore in the Netherlands and Belgium. Then at the last minute, they had to cancel those commitments because they didn't get enough units from LG. At the same time, non-US carriers selling the phone at a much higher price than Google got units ahead of launch time so their customers could physically have the phone today. Hence, you have a number of users posting threads here about problems with their brand new Nexus 4 phones, which they have in hand. So, LG shorted Google to send phones to vendors that sell the Nexus 4 at a higher price. I suspect the whole sales cycle of this phone may be marked by problems between Google and LG, resulting in supply shortages for the lower priced Google-sold phones. If consumers want the phone and don't want to wait for weeks at a time between LG's periodic shipment of a meager supply to Google, you may be forced to buy from other vendors at a higher price or, in the US, a contract commitment to T-Mobile. It looks like Google + LG= oil + water; they don't mix well.
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.... Or maybe not. That's quite the stretch.
shadehh said:
Also the fact that the number of sold devices are not being reported, wouldn't that indicate that the amount of devices are actually not that much after all? (mentioning the # of sold units would discredit their bragging right? - Of course, only if it is not high)
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It is Google's policy not to release sales figures. So it indicates absolutely nothing. Asus released some Nexus 7 sales figures last month and apparently Google was not too happy.
This is what happens when things are under-priced. Whether mandated by law (price controls) or whether a company does it out of its own desire (Nexus 4). Selling something below its true value will lead to shortages because the demand will be too heavy. Combine that with Google probably trying to not overestimate the demand in order to not build too many, it should be no surprise that it sold out so quickly.
FallN said:
If this was Apple then, yes, I would believe it was intentional but honestly the server was crashing. What I saw you can't fake. It was like a DDoS attack. That server was basically brought to its knees. SERIOUSLY.
Sent from my Nexus 7
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very true... i had an N4 in my cart 8 times today (EIGHT freakin times) and each and every time i tried to proceed, i got that craptastic yellow banner telling me that something happened on the back end. their servers were absolutely hammered.
PincheKeith said:
This is what happens when things are under-priced. Whether mandated by law (price controls) or whether a company does it out of its own desire (Nexus 4). Selling something below its true value will lead to shortages because the demand will be too heavy. Combine that with Google probably trying to not overestimate the demand in order to not build too many, it should be no surprise that it sold out so quickly.
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I'm happy with the low price and even if I have to wait a year to get a nexus 4 I'm so happy Google set new standards. I don't find the price too cheap, they could have easily added 50 bucks more for all I care. But I'm glad they set new standards for great hardware all others phone manufacturers must now adjust
I waited all day, from 3:00 AM EST when it was SUPPOSED to launch, to 12:00 PM EST when the "second" launch time was "announced", resulting in two times in which the "Add to Cart" button popped up but didn't work after clicking through. The minute I step inside my house, I rush to my computer, and see a nice, red SOLD OUT sign.
It had to be either a) testing the waters in terms of demand for the device (highly unlikely), b) a publicity stunt in order to garner more (free) attention for the Nexus4 (as we say it, any publicity is good publicity), or c) as stated a shortage of devices as a result between miscommunication/communication breakdowns between LG and Google.
Thoroughly disappointed. I sold my phone (GNexus) in the hopes of upgrading for very little $, and now I'm stuck with no phone at all.
oceansaber said:
I waited all day, from 3:00 AM EST when it was SUPPOSED to launch, to 12:00 PM EST when the "second" launch time was "announced", resulting in two times in which the "Add to Cart" button popped up but didn't work after clicking through. The minute I step inside my house, I rush to my computer, and see a nice, red SOLD OUT sign.
It had to be either a) testing the waters in terms of demand for the device (highly unlikely), b) a publicity stunt in order to garner more (free) attention for the Nexus4 (as we say it, any publicity is good publicity), or c) as stated a shortage of devices as a result between miscommunication/communication breakdowns between LG and Google.
Thoroughly disappointed. I sold my phone (GNexus) in the hopes of upgrading for very little $, and now I'm stuck with no phone at all.
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man, i feel you. i sold my gnex and my backup (g2x) device in anticipation of the nexus 4. I'm old and tired. So, i'm just going to go to my tmobile store and pick up a note 2. I got one for my wife last week and she has been completely satisfied with it. I'll re-evaluate the state of android in a couple months, whereby I might sell the note 2 to finally get the nexus 4. we'll see.
If you believe that its all a conspiracy, put your aluminum foil hat back on and go sit in the corner.
PincheKeith said:
This is what happens when things are under-priced. Whether mandated by law (price controls) or whether a company does it out of its own desire (Nexus 4). Selling something below its true value will lead to shortages because the demand will be too heavy. Combine that with Google probably trying to not overestimate the demand in order to not build too many, it should be no surprise that it sold out so quickly.
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Click to collapse
Finally someone who understand economics.
Put gas half price today. Guess what will happen. Even if gas stations prepared. EVERYONE will gas and you can't prepare for that. Supply is driven by how valuable it is to sell. Demand is determined by how much value you get. They released a 600$ phone at 300$. Take off your tinfoil hats and go to school.
There is no conspiracy. We are talking about about a relatively small cell phone player in LG and a device with a small profit margin. Considering that both these companies are banking on the same profit model, ie, google wants large volume sales for ads and LG wants large volume to compensate for smaller net profits per phone. With the next big phone literally always around the corner, to delay sales in any way is very bad for both companies.
shadehh said:
I don't find the price too cheap, they could have easily added 50 bucks more for all I care.
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Then it is too cheap If people are willing to pay $400 or $450, and they sell it for $350, that's too cheap. That's why demand is (and should be!) so high.
I don't think they did this intentionally, they have a great device at a great price and it sold out.
There's a rumor on french websites about LG not very happy about the success of the N4, for various reasons:
- Not enough profit per phone and market breaker, LG set a new price standard which every high end phones can't compete, including LG Optimus G, and not so enjoyable hypothesis for future smartphones sales and profits.
- Hence its limitation for very few countries when it can easily be sold in every national Play Store with scheduled launches and good will.
It's a flagship not destined to be massively sold, just a flag.
- Carriers/Hardware suppliers/Competition (legal threats) pressure?
What do you think ?
Wooven said:
There's a rumor on french websites about LG not very happy about the success of the N4, for various reasons:
- Not enough profit per phone and market breaker, LG set a new price standard which every high end phones can't compete, including LG Optimus G, and not so enjoyable hypothesis for future smartphones sales and profits.
- Hence its limitation for very few countries when it can easily be sold in every national Play Store with scheduled launches and good will.
It's a flagship not destined to be massively sold, just a flag.
- Carriers/Hardware suppliers/Competition (legal threats) pressure?
What do you think ?
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Click to collapse
I think im hungry and need to eat lunch.
N4 is a chance for LG to show they can do high end and quality. How they were convinced to have this selling beside the optimus g but at half the price I doubt we'll ever know.
Besides that, obviously nobody but those looking to get one are happy about it. Given that this is only a win for consumers, wouldn't surprise me to see LG give poor stock, although it may not be up to them and already be in a big contract.
Sent from my SAMSUNG-SGH-I727 using Tapatalk 2
It doesn't matter whether LG is happy or not; this is the course that the Illuminati mapped out for mankind after world leaders made contact with extraterrestrial intelligences shortly after WWII. Through the United Nations, which is really a puppet regime of the Illuminati designed to prepare us for contact with advanced alien lifeforms and technology, they ensure that this kind of high-end tech will slowly but steadily become cheaper so that we all become so used to having it be an integral part of our lives until we accept the idea of it being integrated biologically and the aliens can use it to turn us into mindless, cybernetic slaves.
Now that is a conspiracy theory, my friend.
I LOLd.
Gesendet von meinem HTC Desire mit Tapatalk 2
MaxCarnage said:
It doesn't matter whether LG is happy or not; this is the course that the Illuminati mapped out for mankind after world leaders made contact with extraterrestrial intelligences shortly after WWII. Through the United Nations, which is really a puppet regime of the Illuminati designed to prepare us for contact with advanced alien lifeforms and technology, they ensure that this kind of high-end tech will slowly but steadily become cheaper so that we all become so used to having it be an integral part of our lives until we accept the idea of it being integrated biologically and the aliens can use it to turn us into mindless, cybernetic slaves.
Now that is a conspiracy theory, my friend.
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What?
I would have never considered a LG phone if it wasn't for this Nexus.
They are proving that they can build decent phones(hopefully). This will open them up to a lot of people like me who never took them seriously.
jmejiaa said:
I would have never considered a LG phone if it wasn't for this Nexus.
They are proving that they can build decent phones(hopefully). This will open them up to a lot of people like me who never took them seriously.
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The Nexus 4 only came to be because Google guided/forced them to make it how THEY wanted it done.
If you want to see LG's industrial design/interface go look at the Optimus G and the gazillion other LG phones which didn't sell well (In the U.S. at least).
The only thing the Nexus 4 proves is that Google can turn a phone all about the specs into something that actually looks good and has decent specs.
jmejiaa said:
I would have never considered a LG phone if it wasn't for this Nexus.
They are proving that they can build decent phones(hopefully). This will open them up to a lot of people like me who never took them seriously.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
This is what it really boils down to, I think. LG is a substantially smaller player in the smartphone game (at least in the States), and designing the flagship Android phone for Google will only help them to establish a better name for themselves in the U.S. market. Whatever loss or minimal profit there is to be had with the Nexus 4, the key is that people who might never have even considered an LG phone before are now clamoring for one. Who knows? If it's a great phone, I might become an LG fan.
Is it time for a mandatory IQ test before posting?
Sent from my Nexus 4 using xda premium
enviii said:
The Nexus 4 only came to be because Google guided/forced them to make it how THEY wanted it done.
If you want to see LG's industrial design/interface go look at the Optimus G and the gazillion other LG phones which didn't sell well (In the U.S. at least).
The only thing the Nexus 4 proves is that Google can turn a phone all about the specs into something that actually looks good and has decent specs.
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Click to collapse
Not really, the optimus G has been getting great reviews as well, but I would have never considered it.
Most likely the Nexus came to be because they came at google with the best bid and Google took them up on the bid. If samsung would have given them a better offer I'm sure they would have taken it.
jmejiaa said:
Most likely the Nexus came to be because they came at google with the best bid and Google took them up on the bid. If samsung would have given them a better offer I'm sure they would have taken it.
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Yes that is exactly how the nexus phone happened
Sent from my Nexus 4 using xda premium
Wooven said:
There's a rumor on french websites about LG not very happy about the success of the N4, for various reasons:
- Not enough profit per phone and market breaker, LG set a new price standard which every high end phones can't compete, including LG Optimus G, and not so enjoyable hypothesis for future smartphones sales and profits.
- Hence its limitation for very few countries when it can easily be sold in every national Play Store with scheduled launches and good will.
It's a flagship not destined to be massively sold, just a flag.
- Carriers/Hardware suppliers/Competition (legal threats) pressure?
What do you think ?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I think you need something better than Babelfish.
I am not sure what you are saying.
MaxCarnage said:
...they ensure that this kind of high-end tech will slowly but steadily become cheaper...
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Click to collapse
Krugman refers to this as the Tchotchke Economy. It's been forced upon us by the elite, the so called "anointed ones".. it goes deep, too: prime ministers, Hollywood, the heads of academia, bankers. Only a select few. Could it be when you have all the power and all the money and all the lands and all the art, you have to do something new, you have to provide cheap cellphones to geeks just to spite LG?
crachel said:
Krugman refers to this as the Tchotchke Economy. It's been forced upon us by the elite, the so called "anointed ones".. it goes deep, too: prime ministers, Hollywood, the heads of academia, bankers. Only a select few. Could it be when you have all the power and all the money and all the lands and all the art, you have to do something new, you have to provide cheap cellphones to geeks just to spite LG?
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Click to collapse
It was Krugman too who insisted that an alien invasion would be the best thing to happen to the global economy:
http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2012/06/19/paul-krugman-alien-invasion_n_1609805.html
I think that we've made the final connection; the aliens are amongst us and the war of the worlds is about to begin. The catalyst: Nexus 4.
Just hypothetical questions....
If you are Samsung, how would you compete versus N4 given the very low price?
Don't you think the Android market is now less attractive for you?
Suddenly, you are now forced to come low price products...
Suddenly, you now cannot have more profits...
What's your take on this?
If N4 is being sold in the street store, with this quality and the same low price as Play Store... Who would buy SGS3? Who would buy LG OG?...
Suddenly, all other high end Android becoming unattractive... Don't you think?
Sent from my Nexus 7 using xda premium
gogol said:
Just hypothetical questions....
If you are Samsung, how would you compete versus N4 given the very low price?
Don't you think the Android market is now less attractive for you?
Suddenly, you are now forced to come low price products...
Suddenly, you now cannot have more profits...
What's your take on this?
If N4 is being sold in the street store, with this quality and the same low price as Play Store... Who would buy SGS3? Who would buy LG OG?...
Suddenly, all other high end Android becoming unattractive... Don't you think?
Sent from my Nexus 7 using xda premium
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I think Samsung has built a fan base, similar to Apple. I can't stand whenever people talk about Android, it's all Samsung.
So I'm not worried about them not able to compete.
I also have a conspiracy that my neighbors upstairs and downstairs have sex at the same time just to annoy me.
Very relevant.
richteralan said:
I think Samsung has built a fan base, similar to Apple. I can't stand whenever people talk about Android, it's all Samsung.
So I'm not worried about them not able to compete.
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They are (1) not nearly as cultish and (2) despite what you may think, they're probably more devoted to software than the hardware. I think the immense demand for the N4 speaks volumes. Price matters, and there is no other phone that comes even remotely close at this price.
enviii said:
What?
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Seriously? If you didn't know about all of this you're blind
Sent from my MB860 using xda app-developers app
Google does subsidize the Nexus line. There was an argument a few weeks back about if google subsidizes it's nexus here it is
"We already recognize that the company is likely subsidizing their own pricing on the Nexus 5 at $349 while the carriers are selling it off contract for $100 more. "
http://9to5google.com/2013/11/15/ed...-is-to-out-nokia-nokia-and-its-going-to-work/
I'm sure Google make money from each device sold.
Cell companies make money, they make high MSRP, so make even more money. It is what they do.
jimmyjoebob said:
I'm sure Google make money from each device sold.
Cell companies make money, they make high MSRP, so make even more money. It is what they do.
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Did you read the article? Google is not trying to make money from the hardware in nexus or Motorola it's about the software and ad sales and search engine proliferation
That's not proof of anything. It's one guy's opinion that Google is "likely" subsidizing them.
How much do you think it costs to build a smartphone? You're looking at maybe $200-$250 for material costs and then a bit for marketing. When Apple (for example) sells someone a 64gb iPhone for $849, there's roughly $600 of pure profit worked into that price. The only difference with the N5 is that Google is selling the phones basically at cost rather than artificially inflating a $200 bill of materials with a bunch of profit. There's no "subsidizing" going on.
maxpower7 said:
That's not proof of anything. It's one guy's opinion that Google is "likely" subsidizing them.
How much do you think it costs to build a smartphone? You're looking at maybe $200-$250 for material costs and then a bit for marketing. When Apple (for example) sells someone a 64gb iPhone for $849, there's roughly $600 of pure profit worked into that price. The only difference with the N5 is that Google is selling the phones basically at cost rather than artificially inflating a $200 bill of materials with a bunch of profit. There's no "subsidizing" going on.
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In other words you just proved me correct. If a phone costs 250 to build the other costs would be more than 100 dollars and therefore the point is not to make a profit on nexus and now Motorola's hardware ( which neither have ever brought a profit) it is to proliferate google services and Ad revenue. All the while giving the consumer the affordability in cheaper phones while increasing their reach with their services.
AndreaCristiano said:
If a phone costs 250 to build the other costs would be more than 100 dollars
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That's pure speculation on your part unless you've actually seen Google's financial data. I really don't think that marketing costs for the N5 add up to more than 100 bucks per phone. What other costs are you taking into consideration?
I agree, it's just an opinion.
However, Google's Motorola phone effort is more likely trying to kill the competition (Apple, Samsung, etc) by lowering prices while maintaining state of the art performance. Samsung sees the writing on the wall and is trying to establish an OS, app and tune market, etc.
If the components cost x and the phone sells for y, there is a huge missing piece, a few actually. Development costs, qa, regulations, etc.
In the case of android, and especially the nexus line software development is nill. the Dev was going to happen regardless the nexus. Drivers, and things like that of course aren't free, so there is that software and hardware integration.
Anyway, until someone posts the bom for the phone parts it's hard to even guess, even then it is a guess cause no one is going to release the Dev costs.
Sent from my Nexus 10 using Tapatalk 4
maxpower7 said:
That's pure speculation on your part unless you've actually seen Google's financial data. I really don't think that marketing costs for the N5 add up to more than 100 bucks per phone. What other costs are you taking into consideration?
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Click to collapse
First off it's not speculation. We're working on your numbers 250 for the cost of production for a phone. Being sold at 350 that's 100 dollars. That hundred dollars doesn't cover the advertising, the web presence on the sites, shipping and handling in the sales process, supprt teams for customer service, etc etc there are many costs incurred that the average person doesn't realize. Let's not forget the R&D to make the phone even if it is based off another there was still R&D. In the end it averages out to much more than 100 dollars. Ps it's pretty well known that nexus devices have not made google money and once again it's about the services not the hardware. Example why does iOS have every google app available to expand its reach and increase profitability. If it really wanted android hardware to be the main focus google apps would be android only
TiltedAz said:
I agree, it's just an opinion.
However, Google's Motorola phone effort is more likely trying to kill the competition (Apple, Samsung, etc) by lowering prices while maintaining state of the art performance. Samsung sees the writing on the wall and is trying to establish an OS, app and tune market, etc.
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Click to collapse
Totally on the right track :good:
Are you really using an opinion based article as concrete proof of a company's business plan?
samagon said:
If the components cost x and the phone sells for y, there is a huge missing piece, a few actually. Development costs, qa, regulations, etc.
In the case of android, and especially the nexus line software development is nill. the Dev was going to happen regardless the nexus. Drivers, and things like that of course aren't free, so there is that software and hardware integration.
Anyway, until someone posts the bom for the phone parts it's hard to even guess, even then it is a guess cause no one is going to release the Dev costs.
Sent from my Nexus 10 using Tapatalk 4
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Click to collapse
Although actual figures will not be released educated guesses will obviously bring to realization that 50-100 in profit per phone is not viable
One I'm not using it as proof per se but it is a logical conclusion. I mean have none of you taken business courses in school and or own a business? I did and still own a business. If mine or any other business ran on the supposed razor thin margins that these phones bring to google they would be closed. It's obvious that the focus is on the means that the phones provide google not the phone it' self
Its basically the same principle as giving android away for free Google makes its money off of the services that are within android and its ads.
Sent from my Nexus 5
AndreaCristiano said:
Google does subsidize the Nexus line. There was an argument a few weeks back about if google subsidizes it's nexus here it is
"We already recognize that the company is likely subsidizing their own pricing on the Nexus 5 at $349 while the carriers are selling it off contract for $100 more. "
http://9to5google.com/2013/11/15/ed...-is-to-out-nokia-nokia-and-its-going-to-work/
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Click to collapse
This article means nothing. The phone isn't sold at a loss or even to break even. Now that's my opinion which holds as much stock as this guys opinion
>^.^< Sent from meow nexus5
Your opinion is illogical and doesn't make sense. Just because you believe something to be true doesn't make it so. Also just because Google sells the phone at a loss does not make the phone any less stellar nor does i t make Google inferior. Quite the contrary it makes them quite intelligent because the risk reward is heavily in their favor. Loss of a few million to make a few billion is always smart
Sent from my Nexus 5
AndreaCristiano said:
One I'm not using it as proof per se but it is a logical conclusion. I mean have none of you taken business courses in school and or own a business? I did and still own a business. If mine or any other business ran on the supposed razor thin margins that these phones bring to google they would be closed. It's obvious that the focus is on the means that the phones provide google not the phone it' self
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Have you taken any introductory writing courses in school? If you did you would know you can't cite opinion based articles as fact.
When did I ever say it was fact? No where did I state it was fact. I stated and a few have concurred that it is an educated guess by looking at the numbers. So please unless you have something to contribute don't put words into my mouth
Sent from my Nexus 5
AndreaCristiano said:
First off it's not speculation. We're working on your numbers 250 for the cost of production for a phone. Being sold at 350 that's 100 dollars. That hundred dollars doesn't cover the advertising, the web presence on the sites, shipping and handling in the sales process, supprt teams for customer service, etc etc there are many costs incurred that the average person doesn't realize. Let's not forget the R&D to make the phone even if it is based off another there was still R&D. In the end it averages out to much more than 100 dollars. Ps it's pretty well known that nexus devices have not made google money and once again it's about the services not the hardware. Example why does iOS have every google app available to expand its reach and increase profitability. If it really wanted android hardware to be the main focus google apps would be android only
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I'm well aware of Google's intent with the Nexus program and the fact that they don't make any money off it. My point is that you couldn't possibly know Google's costs associated with building and selling the phone, so everything you're saying is speculation.
I don't have any hard data either, so I could very well be proven wrong. I'm just saying that the article in the OP doesn't prove anything.
No proof positive no. It does lend credence to those whom are like minded and realize that the nexus program and now Motorola are about two things the proliferation of Google services and lowering costs of the competitions phones. All the while operation at a loss for these programs to further the growth in its real mainstay and money making programs search ads etc. I started this thread because some people do not want to see or admit the obvious and for some reason think that it is heresy to even suggest these things
Sent from my Nexus 5