Related
Please bear with me as I convert my thoughts into words.
We all know that symbiotic relationships work. One benefits from the other and the other benefits from the first. Taking the concept from the Driver Bounty thread, I've started to think that it would be very useful an "open air market". No, no, no...that doesn't sound right. Ok, let me use an example.
I think that S2U2 is great, but I think whats better is to have your own specialized custom unlock signature. For example, I would writing my name in cursive and the phone unlocks. Thats hell of a lot nicer than just sliding an icon. I'm willing to pay a maximum of 20 dollars to any one who makes this.
20 bucks. I can already imagine a developer thinking that its not worth their time. However, lets suppose 10 other people are interested in this app and would dish out $20 each, with 10 other people giving $10, and 20 people giving $5. Thats $400. That 400 dollars might be the threshold for a person to "take the challenge" or want to start working on that program.
Driver Bounty thread is a perfect example. Now this is taking that idea and applying to apps.
My thought is that people begin to pour our their ideas. And as ideas are generated, the reasonable ones, the feasable ones, and the worth while ones are selected. (Maybe with a poll?) And once agreed upon a certain app, those people interested would begin to put money in an "XDA Account". This "XDA Account" would just collect money and not withdraw money from peoples accounts until this threshold is met. Meaning I put my money down and it would not be withdrawn from my bank account until a person decides to create the app that is wanted. Once the app is made, he or she can walk off with the money and we can walk off with the app.
This is pretty much the exact same thing from driver bounty thread just applied to applications that people want/are thinking about.
Here are the benefits as I see it:
1. This would generate more people wanting to work on apps and not just relying on donations.
2. This would give the people want they want.
Happy Developers = Happy Users.
Now, lets suppose that my S2U2 idea (probably already been thought of before, in fact I'm sure it has) will catch on. Lets say that those certain people mentioned above would put their money down. Well, maybe a deal would be made. Those people who put their money down would get the app first, and would get updates every once in a while. Where as those who did not put their money down, who still want the app, don't get to reap the benefits.
This way I think we can bring more developers in and generate more applications. But more importantly, those guys who are working hard on these apps would be guaranteed some money, rather than waiting for donations.
Not that I'm against donations, its great! But I think this is also a good idea.
Now, this is all just in my head. I, in no way, would benefit from this as a user other than the fact that I could contribute to coming up with ideas for applications. This is just an idea that would make us all happy.
So what do you guys think? Is this a stupid idea? Has it been done before? Is it already being done and I'm just a moron for not seeing it? Or is this a good idea?
I look forward to seeing your feedback.
Feel free to be mean if this has been mentioned before. I can take it
SEE THIS: http://www.pocketpcaddict.com/forum...yet to see one, but I've never looked either)
I browse the market every day and I see this guy putting apps that consistently get low reviews. His highest ranking app is 3 stars. He spams the market with apps that are overpriced photo galleries that show pics and play sounds of one specific thing. I think we should help him get the message that his high refund/low ranking rates are not giving him. Please reply if you agree that his apps need to stop spamming the market. If you have not tried one yet, look here. I am not doing this to be mean, but he needs to be told not to quit his day job.
Where's the option for "No. I dislike spam apps, but I hate censorship more." ?
So if his apps were malicious would you vote to have them removed? Do you feel spam filters on email are censorship? They fill your box with junk in hopes of making a few dollars off of you. I am against censorship but his apps are rediculous.
So if his apps were malicious would you vote to have them removed?
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There are rules in place for the Market in regards to malicious apps. There would be no need to vote because the gatekeepers of the Market have already said malicious apps would be removed.
Do you feel spam filters on email are censorship?
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Click to collapse
Of course not. The key difference is who gets to decide what is removed. With a spam filter, each user gets to decide whether he wants to see content or not. Any system that removes apps from the Market (that aren't infringing the basic rules as stated above) without your knowledge and consent is basically censorship, whether the decision is made by ten people at Google or a hundred people on xda-dev.
Not if your email provider passes your email through spamhaus you dont. Also I would ****LOVE**** to have a configureable filter but I doubt we will. As an acceptable alternative, I would like for consistantly low rated and highly returned items to be removed. Guess what walmart does if a product gets returned 80% of the time it is sold. Do they ask you?
Also, I am not trying to start a fight with anyone, just stating my view on the subject.
Darkrift said:
Also, I am not trying to start a fight with anyone, just stating my view on the subject.
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I don't care to start a fight either; I'm just pointing out that what you are proposing is a path down a slippery slope, and it generally goes against the "open participation" ethos of Android. You should also keep in mind that one person's junk may be another mans treasure. Would I ever buy one of Khalid's lame $5 joke apps (literally, they're joke books!)? No probably not. That doesn't mean that someone else might not want it.
Edit: Just as an example, back in the early days of Market before developers could geotarget the regions for distribution, some Chinese developers put up some app whose interface was completely Chinese. I think it was a Chinese input method or a frontend for a Chinese website. Regardless, the ignorant fresh T-Mobile masses downloaded it, didn't understand what it was for, and then promptly uninstalled it and rated it zero stars. If you do a filtering system based on ratings, you are giving every uninformed ignoramus an equal say in whether an app is allowed to stay or go.
The Markets sucks! It needs the possibility for user to set their own filter
e.g.
dont show apps publiced by Khalid Shaikh! lower than 2stars, more expensive than x$ and so on..
only show apps of a specifig language (e.g. for traffic,taxi,bus,tv gadgets..)
sort for recently updated and so on .. that's what the market app really needs!
bassbox said:
The Markets sucks! It needs the possibility for user to set their own filter
e.g.
dont show apps publiced by Khalid Shaikh! lower than 2stars, more expensive than x$ and so on..
only show apps of a specifig language (e.g. for traffic,taxi,bus,tv gadgets..)
sort for recently updated and so on .. that's what the market app really needs!
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Click to collapse
Yes, the market app needs customizable local (meaning on a user's own device) filters. That will partially solve the problem of crap apps littering the marketplace. However, I think overhauling Market client is low on the Google Android team's priority list. Unfortunately since it is a proprietary closed source app, there is no way for the dev community to take the matter into its own hands.
You would think that the king of searching would have some sort of decent searching on their own platform..
jashsu said:
Yes, the market app needs customizable local (meaning on a user's own device) filters. That will partially solve the problem of crap apps littering the marketplace. However, I think overhauling Market client is low on the Google Android team's priority list. Unfortunately since it is a proprietary closed source app, there is no way for the dev community to take the matter into its own hands.
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I am planning on developing an interface to the Market which allows for custom filters. I have a prototype Yahoo Pipe, which uses Cyrket to display Market data and allow simple filters. Basically, I can filter out apps that have certain words in the title, are from a certain developer (or more than one), or are below a certain rating threshold.
I will have to agree though on the statement about censorship. While it is true that his apps may be without any true merit, I do not believe that they are (or he is) breaking any of the Market rules or developer agreements. Unfortunately, as we've seen in the the "free" market and the iPhone AppStore, people are willing to download and even spend money on useless apps. I think as long as there is a market for this type of app we will continue to see them. Now, unfortunately that means we all have to deal with him, his apps, and others like him and his apps until either the Market allows for better filtering/sorting or a developer creates this for the community... It is much needed nonetheless.
nEx.Software said:
I am planning on developing an interface to the Market which allows for custom filters. I have a prototype Yahoo Pipe, which uses Cyrket to display Market data and allow simple filters. Basically, I can filter out apps that have certain words in the title, are from a certain developer (or more than one), or are below a certain rating threshold.
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Click to collapse
thats awesome. if its anything like BarTor its going to be good
nEx.Software said:
I am planning on developing an interface to the Market which allows for custom filters. I have a prototype Yahoo Pipe, which uses Cyrket to display Market data and allow simple filters. Basically, I can filter out apps that have certain words in the title, are from a certain developer (or more than one), or are below a certain rating threshold.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
That's good to hear. What I meant is that the actual Market App itself cannot be modified to work the way we want it to. While being able to display Market data with filtering on a PC is nice, the bulk majority of users are still going to be suffering the standard Market app interface.
Unfortunately, as we've seen in the the "free" market and the iPhone AppStore, people are willing to download and even spend money on useless apps. I think as long as there is a market for this type of app we will continue to see them. Now, unfortunately that means we all have to deal with him, his apps, and others like him
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There will be more, that much I can assure you. As the Android platform grows, there will be more opportunist developers seeking to make a quick buck. It really is like spam. You throw a line out and because digital publishing is free, anything you get back is profit. There is basically no monetary risk involved in creating and distributing crapware. Atleast we won't have to suffer iPhone's idiotic ninety-nine cent "custom" name dialers. Although the number of soundboards posted daily is reaching dangerous limits...
I intend to make it an Android app. While it won't be a permanent fix,it might be what is needed to get Google moving on updates to the official Market app.
Anyway, on another note. I haven't looked at any one of the apps in question but I would venture a guess that they are in violation of copyright laws and as we have seen with the Tetris clones, Google does take action on matters of copyright. Maybe the best recourse then is to inform this developer of the copyright issues either directly or through Google.
?
Frankly i can't agree with having a dev (does this word really apply in this case) removed from the market for producing crap. However i am completely in favour of spamming his inbox with as much crap as i can possibly manage just to see how he likes it. Free porn search here i come!
Anyone wants to help it's --EMAIL REMOVED-- Yes this is a very childish response but i'm pissed with having to sift through his crap every morning, i think it's only fair!
Ideally google can resolve this issue by allowing to create a list of blocked developers. And the ability to block any apps containing the word soundboard would make my day
nEx.Software an app that was basically cryket.com for the android would be awesome. What would really be sweet was if it had an independant comment system that was filterable as well. So we could ban commenters based on their username, words, etc... Filtering by ratings, developer, keywords, etc.. I love it already. Just link the products to their entries in the market. Basically, cryket for the android with comments... I CAN HAZ IT NOW PLZ K?
Also, I'd love to add IndiaNIC, LLC to the filter list. I'm sure *someone* out there likes that they're putting out 300 e-books about India a day, but I'm sure tired of scrolling past them.
The last thing I'd want is to see rigorous policing on the Android Market. He's spreading expensive crapware but I'm sure people are buying it and I'm sure some actually enjoyed it. I don't think removing his apps from the market is the best solution, keep the market as free from censorship as possible if you ask me.
I think the best solution is market search filters as discussed above.
I agree, the ability to "ignore" certain developers would be nice. The new developer I would instantly add to this list would be IndiaNIC, LLC. or whatever the hell they are called. They have about 40 apps on the market, and I don't think a single one has a comment.
/if anyone affiliated with IndiaNIC, LLC reads this, no offense, but please get the message when nobody is buying what you're selling
The more I think about it, the more I realize a filter would be a better idea than removing junk from the market. While I do not agree that anyone will find his apps useful, I do see the point in letting them choose. But at the same time we should be able to choose not to see his crap. As for IndiaNIC, I disagree with placing them in the same category. They have products with good ratings and seem to be making at least SOME useful apps. While I agree they put out too many at once, they seem to have a market for their apps unlike Khalid Shaikh.
Still, a filter would be better for all. I wish I could edit the poll now to add that as an option
ryan75 said:
/if anyone affiliated with IndiaNIC, LLC reads this, no offense, but please get the message when nobody is buying what you're selling
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Spammers don't need to "get the message"! They know exactly what they are selling (junk). The whole point is they are trying to make a quick buck. And in the immortal words of P.T. Barnum: "There's a sucker born every minute."
Nevermind the fact that all of those texts can be downloaded for free from manybooks or feedbooks and then read on FBReaderJ...
There was recently some talk on this Forum about Yongzh rereleasing N64oid. I went on the Market 10 minutes ago and was shocked to see that none of his emulators were in the "Top 10 Games" section of the Market. I then did a search for first, his Developer account, and that yielded no results. Then I searched for every emulator that he has released, which still yielded no results. Me thinks there has been foul play... What do you guys think is happening?
Yea, realised this before, im scared.... ive been looking forward to n64oid for ages.... still searching for answers...
This is exactly what happened to ZODTTD, someone should tweet him about it and look for some answers.
yeh i just noticed they were no longer under my purchased app list in the market also... even when n64oid was gone it would show up under my purchased list but say that the emulator couldn't be found... now its absolutely nothing at all... something foul is afoot :/
hmmm i hope i get a chance i never used an emulator on mu droid
I noticed this as well. Does Yongzh post anywhere we can see status updates?
OMG if it is Goole for real who is baning the accouts i start hating the company...
I talked to yongzh about it and this is his respones
From: Yongzh
Google pulled all my emulators, explaining that they violated the distribution terms on the Android Market, but without mentioning the details.
I am considering hosting my apps on SlideME (a 3rd-party app store). I will make them free for download for a limited period of time (eg. a week) to avoid existing customers from having to pay again.
Thanks very much for your understanding and support!
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I Also Talked to google about it and this is what they had to say:
Greetings,
Thanks for your inquiry. It looks like the applications you referred to
are no longer available on Android Market due to violations of our Terms
of Service. You may view those terms here:
http://www.android.com/us/developer-distribution-agreement.html
http://www.android.com/market/terms/developer-content-policy.html
If you'd like additional details, we recommend you contact the developer
directly.
Let me know if I can assist you with anything further.
Regards,
Eric
The Android Market Team
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Click to collapse
Started a support thread here. (WARNING: strong language)
ok yongzh apps are on slideme for free for a little while: http://slideme.org/applications?text=yongzh
engagdget artical: http://www.engadget.com/2011/05/29/android-markets-most-popular-emulators-disappear-without-a-trac/
Thank god he lets people dl it for free i bought all his apps and forgot to save them. Good guy always loved his support and customer service. Bought all his apps from the market. stupid google
Sent from my SGH-T959 using XDA App
http //www reddit com/r/Android/comments/hmwj7/android_markets_most_popular_emulators_disappear/
http //www snes9x com/phpbb2/viewtopic.php?t=4454
http //www gp32x com/board/index.php?/topic/58889-n64-for-android/
ok another update from zodttd
Hello, ZodTTD here again.
Things have been rough as of late. Please read this one through as it will also shine a little light on why products and updates have not been rolling out. I’ve been extremely busy getting things straight in the “real world”. Though Google’s takedown of my Market and Checkout account couldn’t have come at a worse time. As you may have seen, Yong Zhang (yongzh) of Android emulator fame, was also taken down from Market by Google in the same manner that I was.
First and foremost, our takedowns have nothing to do with any sort of open source licensing violation. Both Yong and I handle developer relations behind the scenes. We give cuts to original authors at times, and I have posted sources to my source repository. Though there is a lot of rhetoric surrounding this, it is not an issue.
Google has no developer relations and support. Instead of Google simply removing the application in question, psx4droid, they did that and followed up a week later suspending my entire Market and Checkout account, with no interaction on my part.
And what happens when you suspend a Market account with a case such as Yong’s with lots of customers? Well you get hellish levels of emails, tweets, etc. that I must respond to most of every day. What’s worse is these customers are pretty stranded by Google. We can’t verify that many customers by hand. There’s no way to honor these previous customers, effectively killing our products. We can’t even issue a refund to users who are furious.
Yong’s emulators built Market up and gave it purpose when there was little to care about on there. Google was well aware of Yong’s top selling apps. Why is Google killing off developers (not even apps but the developer accounts!) that helped them get to where they’re at now? I wonder if they were aware all along. Take high risk apps, make themselves look all nice and open, then once they approach AppStore reach, they pull the developers they used. World may never know.
Right now as it stands, there’s little to no chance of Yong or I getting back on Market without a fight. I appealed and lost with Google in a canned response manner. I can go to 3rd party storefronts, but they have such a small number of users compared to Market, it’s not really an option with the large amount of effort these apps take.
For Cydia fans out there, I apologize for my lack of updates. But with all that has been happening, it made updating so many products nearly impossible. Things have snowballed and I now have so much work to do on Cydia products that it too has become more work than it’s worth.
So I wonder where that leaves me. This has killed my spirits immensely and I think it’s time to change things up.
Click to expand...
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source: http://www.zodttd.com/wp/2011/05/it-hit-hard/
Although I don't currently possess the skills contribute to the development of a custom OS or update patches, I do plan to learn and am very willing donate to those who are willing to keep our Pebbles alive and relevant well into the future.
Kudos to all that are ready, capable and willing to tackle the challenge. I am almost certain that I am not alone in these sentiments.
Update (2016-12-16):
A former Pebble employee has created a script to all the mass export of folk's apps and will, once the servers go down, start a new instance to allow the bulk import of all that app development. (Bulk CloudPebble Project Export - https://www.reddit.com/r/pebble/comments/5h61om/bulk_cloudpebble_project_export/)
Also, a free PDF of "Learning C with Pebble" is available and I hope to dive into it soon. (Pick up your free copy of the Book "Learning C with Pebble" - https://www.reddit.com/r/pebble/comments/5h6s1s/pick_up_your_free_copy_of_the_book_learning_c/)
All the best!
Hear hear... I'm sure the fans and users will keep the pebble alive.
jmunr017 said:
Although I don't currently possess the skills contribute to the development of a custom OS or update patches, I do plan to learn and am very willing donate to those who are willing to keep our Pebbles alive and relevant well into the future.
Kudos to all that are ready, capable and willing to tackle the challenge. I am almost certain that I am not alone in these sentiments.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I'm hoping that pebble users will fight back by keeping our pebbles alive for a long time.
I'm saddened immensely. ?
I got the very first pebble. I loved it and I was a Kickstart backer for pebble time.
I was in total shock when I first learned of pebble discontinuation. I was in shocked.
Why was this. It makes no sense.
So we will have a watch and it won't be supported. Essentially we'll have a device that will be frozen in time and will no longer be updated and that's it. Done.
This totally sucks.
I'm never going to purchase anything from Kickstarter period there's no sustainable value to back them up.
Very upset, and disheartened
KP
Fitbit has got most IP of Pebble software, it depends on them to release or not the source code for Pebble hardware, I think?
Fitbit bought Pebble precisely to kill it. There won't be any pebble development, source code or anything else. Pebble does not exists anymore, Fitbit only acquired some brains and intelectual property, not the brand, the products or commitments to existing customers. Effectively yesterday, there is no pebble. Even the app, if you reinstall clean on a new phone, you will notice there is no login to pebble account, because there isn't any. It will configure as a local app with google fit sync, but int's only one way sync, from the app to google fit, not the other way arround.
It is sad, but as many things in tech world today, you are not buying a product, you are buying associated services, and these can disappears unexpectedly. Then the product becomes just a piece of black plastic or, if lucky a pretty expensive electronic watch.
crisagatie said:
Fitbit bought Pebble precisely to kill it. There won't be any pebble development, source code or anything else. Pebble does not exists anymore, Fitbit only acquired some brains and intelectual property, not the brand, the products or commitments to existing customers. Effectively yesterday, there is no pebble. Even the app, if you reinstall clean on a new phone, you will notice there is no login to pebble account, because there isn't any. It will configure as a local app with google fit sync, but int's only one way sync, from the app to google fit, not the other way arround.
It is sad, but as many things in tech world today, you are not buying a product, you are buying associated services, and these can disappears unexpectedly. Then the product becomes just a piece of black plastic or, if lucky a pretty expensive electronic watch.
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Click to collapse
I respectfully disagree that there won't be any development. There is a strong community of users to find new innovative ways to keep legacy devices alive. It's the driving force of XDA and what brings a lot of us here.
Here's an exchange that I had with a Pebble app developer after I just donated to him for his watchface.
I wrote, "Please keep writing apps for Pebble! It can use all the developer support it can get now. Thanks so much!"
And he replied, "Thank you so much for your support! And yes I won't stop! Like Katharine (former head of Pebble dev team) put it: "We will keep coding for these Pebbles until batteries die!""
TL;DR - there's still a future for Pebble watches.
Sorry, I meant official development. Of course community will keep things going for as long as possible. But already is a thread on Reddit and users report devs withdrawing apps from pebble app store. The store will probably be gone soon, as nobody will pay for cloud services and server side functionality will phase out. It will not be instant, but unless some entity will not see the business benefits of keep going (and that means money), it will eventually die.
crisagatie said:
. Even the app, if you reinstall clean on a new phone, you will notice there is no login to pebble account, because there isn't any. It will configure as a local app with google fit sync, but int's only one way sync, from the app to google fit, not the other way arround.
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I installed the Pebble app 2 days ago, for the first time. It let me create an account, no problem
^ this. created new account and logged in fine.
kparikh82276 said:
I'm never going to purchase anything from Kickstarter period there's no sustainable value to back them up.
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Don't you think that's a little extreme? They had a good, long run, and then they were acquired by another company. Neither you nor they nor anybody else could have predicted how this went down back when they got going. I hope you do continue to support new technologies - it's the only way we'll move forward.
bradyarz said:
Don't you think that's a little extreme? They had a good, long run, and then they were acquired by another company. Neither you nor they nor anybody else could have predicted how this went down back when they got going. I hope you do continue to support new technologies - it's the only way we'll move forward.
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Click to collapse
It may be extreme, but they developed a movement then sold it. So now the pebble os is more..
In few months to years.... What am I going to do with my pebbles.... They won't be useful with newer versions of OS
It just was very disappointing. So that is why I will not hold my breath for a Kickstarter company. Pebble was a trailblazer but how they fizzled.... I'm still trying to wrap my head around this
Greetings people of earth and other creatures!
Greedy people are trying sell you phones every year by using complicity of the mobile operation system.
Logic is simple.
Stock Android:
Full of c*rap.
Different kind of messengers, browsers, other useless app, which are installed as system apps and have an unlimited access to your input sensors.
Most of the apps rely on Google for push notifications, which makes a possibility that no matter the security of the messager to read them.
Do I need to tell more?
AOSP Roms:
When you install AOSP firmware on your system your phone won't be the same, in many cases camera or other hardware work differently. Anything could be in those unreadable partitions which selfs-wipes after unlocking.
Project Tomahawk:
The goals are to give people a key to their privacy and to reduce plastic waste by giving old devices a second life.
We gonna go the opposite way and to make Android lighter and simpler, removing all the "debugging" tools and "cloud services" from your phone. Making it work without monopoly services installed. That's just a step one.
Example
Contribution:
Anyone can contribute to the project by donating old devices, doing voluntary work , spread the information in your circles. Students are welcome here. Companies are welcome too, but the project will be in the heands of Community.
Doom Slayer said:
Greetings people of earth and other creatures!
Greedy people are trying sell you phones every year by using complicity of the mobile operation system.
Logic is simple.
Stock Android:
Full of c*rap.
Different kind of messengers, browsers, other useless app, which are installed as system apps and have an unlimited access to your input sensors.
Most of the apps rely on Google for push notifications, which makes a possibility that no matter the security of the messager to read them.
Do I need to tell more?
AOSP Roms:
When you install AOSP firmware on your system your phone won't be the same, in many cases camera or other hardware work differently. Anything could be in those unreadable partitions which selfs-wipes after unlocking.
Project Tomahawk:
The goals are to give people a key to their privacy and to reduce plastic waste by giving old devices a second life.
We gonna go the opposite way and to make Android lighter and simpler, removing all the "debugging" tools and "cloud services" from your phone. Making it work without monopoly services installed. That's just a step one.
Example
Contribution:
Anyone can contribute to the project by donating old devices, doing voluntary work , spread the information in your circles. Students are welcome here. Companies are welcome too, but the project will be in the heands of Community.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Allow me to introduce myself. I see your predicament and completely agree. I grew up with an old saying that one man's rubbish is another man's treasure and I think what you're projecting is a very positive thing.
Personally I've never heard of Tomahawk and I'm interested in finding out more about it but at the moment I'm I'm trying not to multitask you see c
I think your doing great.
Hopefully the following link to one of my all time favorite directors quotes and just views can help guide you on your journey my friend as it has with me.
https://www.goodreads.com/author/quotes/314980.Jim_Jarmusch
@2ISAB,
I feel you.
Thank you for the link, friend!
I am from country that you can leave, but it won't leave you. Stays in the head and keep you paranoid.
That's my personal interest in it, to finally be able to speak like back then.
Mission's goal is to help people get their privacy and we need everyone.
Idea is that simplicity is a key to perfection.
I am refurbishing old devices to make them "keep up" with new and "more powerful" devices.
As the result: better speed, better battery life and more privacy.
It can reduce plastic waste I guess.
And some people like older devices because they are awesome and have some sentimental value, but they work slow, as we used to the new "speed".
Maybe send it them who need it more.
Anyone?
I want to bring an easy to use, one button solution for securing a phone and giving people control over privacy.
This project will help to reduce waste by donating refubrished devices as an aid to 3rd-word countries.
Doom Slayer said:
Anyone?
<snip words>
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Click to collapse
Anyone what bro?