Does any one knows if these (awesome) features from iOS might show up in WP8?
I got iPad and Lumia 710 and as much as I love WP7 Apple had done one thing reasonably - it shop/s.
I use Netflix, Hulu and other services through VPN. On iOS it wan not a problem to setup 3 different accounts for 3 different markets US,UK and Poland. Also, because EU itself (inside) is almost like USA (travel and work wise) I don't understand why MS choose to divide EU market so much.
It is like if you by WP and are registered in NY once you move to California you will not get access to local apps registered in California Marketplace. Same thing here I live in Poland and in UK. I got back accounts in those 2 places I need to be able to get the apps I want without loosing those from different region I already had (paid for).
And I miss VPN for the times when I am away/abroad.
Any ideas if WP8 will be different here to WP7.5?
MS has been hit with monopoly/other laws in EU for a while now, each EU country has their own set of laws, might be why there are different EU markets... now why this doesn't apply to apple/google I have no idea :S
not based on location, but different carriers have different apps hidden by google :S this could be same as your EU markets?
eyeb said:
not based on location, but different carriers have different apps hidden by google :S this could be same as your EU markets?
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Still with Android this is a child play to get them anyway. With iOS, free stuff from any itunes store is easily available only WP is a problem. Shame as I really like Lumia 920... but since GxSIII is and will be much cheaper and without any issues mentioned above I might go with it
You legally shouldn't be able to access apps from other markets unless you're physically in that market. There's a reason why the app isn't available in your market. It's due to copyright issues. Netflix, hulu, etc aren't available in Poland, or UK, or wherever, because they don't have a right to distribute their libraries to those countries. You accessing that is going against this limitation.
Tl;dr: Windows Phone does it right by only allowing one marketplace per device. However, people should be able to switch what it is when they move, limited to a certain amount of times per year to prevent abuse like what you're trying to do.
vladzaharia said:
You legally shouldn't be able to access apps from other markets unless you're physically in that market. There's a reason why the app isn't available in your market. It's due to copyright issues. Netflix, hulu, etc aren't available in Poland, or UK, or wherever, because they don't have a right to distribute their libraries to those countries. You accessing that is going against this limitation.
Tl;dr: Windows Phone does it right by only allowing one marketplace per device. However, people should be able to switch what it is when they move, limited to a certain amount of times per year to prevent abuse like what you're trying to do.
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In theory you are right, but... accessing app and accessing service - not exactly the same thing.
+ all this is fine, but it is just a nice theory, not really for XXI century. Unfortunately copyright law (as well as patent law, especially in USA) are still based in XX century. This means that it is all working against the market and only to uphold monopoly and make the competition as small as possible, Rules and laws that are still in power in regard of copyright would not be allowed anywhere else, but "entertainment" and media it is very rich and very powerful industry (like tobacco and oil). This is why we get ACTA, PIPA, SOPA and more to come. They will do anything to prevent the change,
Ok... enough of off topic.
You say people should be allowed to change market few time per year... OK. How many is few? What if you travel frequently between USA, UK, Poland, Germany? What is you run out of those changes? You paid for the phone, you will pay for the service... you can not get it.
You say MS did it right??? Don't agree. My Live ID was setup when I was living in the UK (for few years). Now I live in Poland (but again I do plan to move). Unfortunately I cant use Polish apps although I bough my device here and I am here for the last 3 years. Should I setup up another Live ID just for Poland? Ok... I might... I can will buy stuff and than what if I will go back to UK?
Even apps that are available on both markets I will have to buy again, just because I have moved to different region of world? Can you imagine buying Angry Birds today and again i a year time just because you changes state and need to get different apps from "local" market?
In my opinion what Apple did is the best compromise. If you hold the CC you can register to new market and you don't loose your prev purchases. And free apps - where is the harm?
There is plenty small, cool apps - offered free only in Poland or UK just because their creators never thought some one from other country would be interested. And I suppose it cost more (per developer) if they want to offer their app world wide instead of just 1 country.
Would you agree (and pay) if your Windows PC would have the same kind of limitations?
Would you be OK if your car would have them?
Would you be OK if clothes you buy would be licensed to wear only in one country? After all trousers by Levis are sold in different prices in different markets.... you buying them cheap in USA and not buying in EU = loose of money for manufacturer.
Netflix gets my money, copyright owners and artists get the share... so what - my cash is not as good as Mr. Smiths from NY or Suth Dakota?
Yes it is... because idea is that for the same movie I should pay 3 times as much here..in EU. Fair?
+ quite a lot of movies I watch at Netflix I own on DVD anyway - it is just so much more convenient to stream than to play with different dvd each evening. But I do not have choice of similar service in EU.
Last thing I would add are exclusive deals signed by each of services Netflix, Amazon Prime, Hulu, etc... with such popular product as film or music it should not be allowed. If you could access the same library through many different services you would choose the best one. Now service it self can be sht. but you got no choice if you want to watch certain titles.
Laws and copyright laws were supposed to make sure you are protected, that you do not LOOSE money not that you can make even more.
How come USE, EU, Japan, etc is fighting monopoly everywhere but not where movies and music are concerned. It is bad for the artists as well (beside few selected "stars" making millions). Shouldn't market decide - how much it will pay per production?
I do believe i read somewhere wp8 will have vpn support.
ROCOAFZ said:
I do believe i read somewhere wp8 will have vpn support.
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That is good news... question remains about apps from other markets or like in Android case form other than market sources...
Would SGS III be a good chopice instead of Lumia 920 (big screen Netflix and VPN should work)... it shpuld be quite a lot cheaper than Lumia 920...
i would have to certainly go with windows phone 8
ATHORNFAM2 said:
i would have to certainly go with windows phone 8
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Me too. If only I could resolve my two issues - access to VPN servers and availability of apps from different regions (iPlayer form UK and Netflix from US) I would not hesitate even for a higher price.
At the moment I got to go with SGS III and Android (I miss Nokia Drive and Music and Nokia itself already)
For hd2 WP7.5 every market is open with market enabler. You can install all Nokia apps, all HTC app, all Samsung apps, etc. On a "rooted" HTC HD2.
Ok, interesting.
This means that such a trick should also be available to at least some Nokia phones...
I have to say that I like the design of new Nokias. Not to mention that on every meeting 50% have their iPhones, rest has some Samsung, HTC or Sony devices and 100% of the time I am the only raisin with old school Nokia. Now ti seems that some folks are getting jealous...
Any way... HD2 is quite old device and hardware wise can not be as efficient as new 2011/2012 headsets, right?
+ there is one more issue - this trick has to work on WP8. Even if I can download and install Netflix app on WP7.5, without VPN access it is useless.
One more thought... and a question.
Beside interface... Is (or will be) Win8RT and WP8 the same system? If so... why did MS decided to split it into two? (Is there a forum for WinRT here somewhere? If I could make VPN and those apps make work on RT device I could save some money on my iPad replacemnt - at the moment I got to go with the likes of Samsung Smart PC or Asus 810 - Atom CPU + full Win8 Pro onboard.
As far as i know, WinRT is a framework for metro app development on Windows 8 and Windows phone(similar to win32, winFX etc etc), whereas WP is...an operating system. WinRT is integrated in Windows Phone due to the shared kernel.
WinRT is the Windows Runtime on which Metro Apps are built in Windows 8
WinPRT is the Windows Phone Runtime on which many Apps für WP8 are built which has similarities with WinRT but they are NOT identical
Windows RT is the ARM based Version of Windows 8 which does not allow for installation of additional Desktop Applications
WP8 and Windows RT presumably use the same Kernel and some system services but above that layer there are substantial differences. (common core, not common OS).
Microsoft and it's product naming - never fails to confuse people.
Do you know if Windows 8 Pro (x86) and RT (ARM) will have the same limitations regarding installation of apps as Windows Phone?
And does anyone knows why MS went to all the trouble of creating Windows 8 RT, instead of making Windows Phone "richer" - just as Apple did with iOS.
After all...
Windows 8 RT will not be used on desktop (x86) PC's.
If it will have a desktop mode it will be very limited - I don't suppose we will be able to download (ARM) apps of the internet as with Windows 8 Pro (as we do it now).
It will rune the same apps - just few more because tablets will have different (bigger) screens.
The only difference will be in screen size and in its resolution (but not that big - 1366 x 768 vs 1280 x 720).
Same core of the system in both...
Both RT and WP are to run on ARM devices that only differ in size (ARM tablets are phones with larger screens after all).
In my opinion it would make sense to limit ver of Windows 8 to 2 or 3: Windows 8 Pro (x86); Windows 8 Enterprise (x86 for corporations/business, etc.) and Windows 8 Home (for ARM phones/tablets/hybrids). The only difference in the system for ARM devices would be interface (small - Phone and large "PC style" [or even with option to choose between them - as WP8 looks as it could do nicely on 10" screen] on tablet).
In fact, since you can not buy and install ARM system by yourself as you can not buy a device without it it could all just be Windows 8 - for PC, tablet and Phone.
As in Android.... different devices, different manufacturers = different interface but ONE system
You can not run ARM-compiled applications on Desktop Windows (weather it is x86 or x64).
You also can not run desktop compiled (x86 or x64) on ARM.
This is because the machine code between the two is different.
ARM apps can run on Desktop without big differences after they are recompiled.
Windows Phone 8 apps and Metro apps for desktop should be equally as constraint due to shared kernel. There might be some phone-specific stuff which might not work on desktop though. I haven't tried building any metro app yet to give you a detailed answer.
I don't know why you got to the conclusion that WinRT does not run on x86 desktops though....cause it is plain wrong.
WinRT is a framework for Metro apps, not an operating system.
mcosmin222 said:
You can not run ARM-compiled applications on Desktop Windows (weather it is x86 or x64).
You also can not run desktop compiled (x86 or x64) on ARM.
This is because the machine code between the two is different.
ARM apps can run on Desktop without big differences after they are recompiled.
Windows Phone 8 apps and Metro apps for desktop should be equally as constraint due to shared kernel. There might be some phone-specific stuff which might not work on desktop though. I haven't tried building any metro app yet to give you a detailed answer.
I don't know why you got to the conclusion that WinRT does not run on x86 desktops though....cause it is plain wrong.
WinRT is a framework for Metro apps, not an operating system.
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WinRT is an operating system and it is very close to Windows Phone. I suspect that in future we will see both of them grown into one.
WinRT is an ARM version of Windows 8 and as you said your self it will not run Windows 8 "Desktop" software.
What is more I suspect that it will not run (without some additional changes and work) even the apps wrote for x86 Metro - it looks the same but it ain't the same.
However I see no reason why it should not run "straight out of the box" apps from Windows Phone. After all it is exactly the same hardware (in phones) as in Windows RT devices.
Imagine you wrote an app A for "Metro" in x 86 and app B for WP.
If you have 3 devices (with free access/jailbroken) - 1 with Intel and Win8PRO, 1 with WinRT (lets say Tegra3) and 1 of the WP 8 phones what iI suspect is:
A will run (as is ) only on Win8PRO
B will run (as is) on RT device and Phone.
http://www.pocket-lint.com/news/46334/windows-phone-8-windows-rt-separate-for-now - although thois article says that Win8Pro and WinRT are almost the same (unlike) WP... in my opinion it is much closer from WinRT to WP than from WinRT to Win8Pro.
Still, all those 3 are much closer to each other than iOS and MacOS - this means a lot less work for developer and much bigger opportunities.
My question from the post above was quite different. (but I am afraid we go off topic from the main subject - if you prefer to move this post to the right place - I dont mind)
In Win8Pro (I hope) I will have the same freedom I ever had with Windows. This means I can use Windows Store (if I want to) or I can download and install any thing else (with x86 code) from any other source.
Q1: Is it true for both modes - desktop and "Modern Interface" or will be installation of apps for "Modern" interface limited to MS own shop only?
Q2: If I start a program that can run in both modes (desktop/modern) like IE or Chrome (in future) will programs own interface change smothly with system or in reality "desktop mode" and "modern interface" require two separate programs. So if I start Chrome in desktop and move on to "Modern" I will have to start it again and both can run alongside (in the RAM) as two different browsers?
Q3: WindowsRT (ARM devices) it will have limited desktop mode I believe, and as I understand it will not allow for installation of ARM software from outside the Marketplace as WP does today. So even if one of you will write an ARM app I will not be able to use as easily as I could if it would be made for Win8PRO - correct?
Q1) You can install the App on your local machine if you have the Visual studio 2012 and the source code. You will need to upload the thing to marketplace in order to install somewhere else. The compilation produces a .appxrecipe file which is opened by the Windows Store app. The Store looks for the app online and if it doesn't find it...no install >.>
Haven't found a side-load mechanic so far.
Q2) It will require two separate programs.
One will be compiled using a desktop specific framework like WPF or WinForms, whereas the second requires WinRT.
WinRT is not an operating system, it is a framework similar to .NET(WinFX)-> this is the main reason why it is called Windows RunTime
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Windows_Runtime
Actually, Ill try making a mock Metro app and see what happens.
The only similar aspect between the Arm and Desktop versions is the presence of the shared kernel, which is in fact, only shared through its features, cause the base code is different.
If WinRT is not an operating system than what sits in ARM ver of surface tablet or in this device: http://tablet-news.com/2012/09/28/samsung-ativ-tab-ready-for-pre-order-coming-at-the-end-of-october/ - because it is not Windows 8 PRO I can tell you
Regarding you answer for Q2: that truly SUCKS! They went through trouble of making useless version of Win 8 for ARM tablets that is not Win 8 nor WP8 and will be more expensive that iOS/Android competition... but the did not write ?modern interface" in x86 way....
For a guy like me, Mr Average Joe it makes things even more f..ed up. I will have platform segmentation within 1, single device.
Now I will need 2 browsers, 2 mail clients, etc... and even swapping between modes will be like swapping between separate devices...
This is pure crazy!!!
I would not mind having to wait a bit for programs to change their layout and look (like when you now change them on Win7 and everything goes black& white for a moment or when one switches between "traditional Windows" and AREO style - that is what I was expecting.... as it looks now I am not so sure I still want Windows 8 on any of my devices....
The thing running on tablets is Win 8 without the desktop part.
You do not need two mail clients/browsers/whatever.
On Windows Desktop 8, you can continue to use your desktop (which is an app within Metro) and continue to work in a Windows 7-like enviroment. The only thing missing is the start button, which has been replaced by the Metro screen, which is better imo for finding apps than the Start menu if you configure it properly.
You can continue to use your desktop firefox/chroome/whatever and you desktop programs you used on Windows 7 with no problems.
The Metro is only present on desktop computers so that it can help with the tablet-phone-desktop-Xbox interoperability. It is not mandatory, in fact i use it like a start menu to quickly launch desktop apps more than anything else. In fact, Metro apps have quite huge limitations, and inevitably you will need to use the desktop to get to files hidden on your computer.
I've written this replay from a firefox browser within the desktop app on Windows 8, so you can take it for granted
Windows 8 is really not as bad as people make it out to be....it gives you lots of choices and you can continue to use it like windows 7 if you so desire. It has tremendous performance optimizations though...boots in 3 seconds for me(sometimes even faster).
mcosmin222 said:
The thing running on tablets is Win 8 without the desktop part.
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But those tablets are not x86 devices... + MS themselves is calling this Windows RT to make it clear it is not the same as Win 8 Pro.
What is more, ARM tablets are exactly the same as phone (same architecture, SOC's, etc.) just bigger screens...
When you say I do not need to browsers...than what do you suggest I run in the Metro style if (as you said previously) it is not the same app that runs in a desktop mode?
Or... if I start browsing the web browser in a Metro mode what I would want (and what I know now will not happen) is to see my browser with open sites displayed on the task bar once I go to desktop mode.
At least for me this would be a unifying experience... If the Metro mode will be completely separate from desktop mode I might as well stay on Win 7 and get w new device just with metro mode on it (ARM tablet)....
Please tell me I am wrong!!!!
I do not care too much about ARM ver. of Win8 (RT) as I do not plan to get it...
but if Win8Pro means it will be like two separate systems on one device it is scary.
At this point it looks like MS is saying rubbish... as its new interface is not really an interface... its a (almost) complete different system running alongside in a PC.
So... I can not start my program (I understand it would have to have a modern look prepared) in desktop (like today Classic Windows) style and move to modern (or for Win 7 Areo) style and still have the same program with just different layout/look bu the same data on the screen. Yes
If so.. I need to have two browsers to be able to see web sites in both modes, two mail clients..etc...
hi.
If there's currently no way to make a wp8 rom for the lumia 710 would it be possible to somehow run unsupported wp8 applications on it ?
i mean if WP8 ported on HD7 , can i install WP8 apps on my HD7 ?
Apps which are written for WP8 specifically (that is, they use the new APIs, new capabilities, and new language support) will pretty obviously not work on WP7; it's like asking whether an app which requires Windows 95 will run in DOS or even Windows 3.1. Apps which are written using the WP8 SDK but only rely on features present on WP7 *might* work - you could try modifying the app's manifest, and then re-packaging the XAP and sideloading it - but I expect there would be problems even so. The WP7 SDK uses .NET code running on the Silverlight and XNA frameworks; the WP8 SDK uses .NET code or native code, and does not target Silverlight or XNA specifically (although at least parts of both are included in the .NET framework for WP8 apps).
If the WP8 app you wanted to use used only those portions of the WP7 SDK (including languages, capabilities, and APIs), it *might* be possible. I've heard somebody (might be ansar?) is working on this; I'm not sure.
How can you port wp8 on HD7 ?? I mean is it worthy enough to do that??
Sent from my Nexus 4 using Tapatalk 4 Beta
Although (contrary to what Microsoft implied) the HD7 and other WP7 phones are technically capable of running WP8, we don't have the tools necessary to port it over (so far as I know; I don't pay much attention to the ROM scene). Without a port of WP8, or at least its app runtime (which would probably be at least as hard as just bringing the whole OS over), you won't be able to run WP8 apps on your WP7 devices.
GoodDayToDie said:
Although (contrary to what Microsoft implied) the HD7 and other WP7 phones are technically capable of running WP8, we don't have the tools necessary to port it over (so far as I know; I don't pay much attention to the ROM scene). Without a port of WP8, or at least its app runtime (which would probably be at least as hard as just bringing the whole OS over), you won't be able to run WP8 apps on your WP7 devices.
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Technically, yes WP7 phones can run WP8, but practically not so much, because WP8 requires the secure bot chip. While you can work around it, it's very tough.
WP7 is using a CLR based on the old .Net Compact Framework with Libraries based upon Silverlight 4/XNA4. WP8 moved over to the Core CLR that power Silverlight 4/5 on the Desktop and the full .Net Framework on Desktops/Servers. This quite often lead to compatibility problems with WP7 Apps running on WP8. So even if no new APIs are used it would be pretty problematic.
The most important part about WP8-Games that don't run on WP7 is that they are likely to be developed using native code and DirectX and WP7 is missing support for that completely.
Helo there, i was using this to constantly force HSPA on my phone because on default my Lumia 520 just keep reverting to 2G EDGE which is, as you know very, very slow. Especially in my country.
Code was ##3282# or ##3282 for some phones, but unfortunately i updated it to GDR2 hoping that it will continue to exist. This is very crucial app for a lot of WP users in "banana" republics like Serbia.
I saw there is an Native tost notification launcher. Is there any way that i could launch directly field test from it(honestly i do not know how to get free developer account or how to load apps i am newbie in WP world)?
I would be very, very grateful if anyone could show me at least a glimpse into this...
Thanks in advance and sorry for my bad english
Its still there AFAIK. The link to the thread is in my signature.
thals1992 said:
Its still there AFAIK. The link to the thread is in my signature.
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Well that does not answer my questions. In your thread there are codes i mentined before but there is no path specified for cpu's guy tool so i can launch field test.
Those codes you posted no longer work for Lumia 520 after GDR2 update.
Greetings, Stefan
Then you need to download SysApp Pusher from the store. With that app you can check that extras+info is up to date.
EDIT: I'm just going back through the other posts.
To deploy xaps, either need to use a student email account to signup for Dreamspark or just pay $20 or whatever it in your local currency. Both of those gets you a Microsoft Developer account to develop apps and as a side effect, you can add your phone for developer access.
The second thing required is either Windows 7 x64 (If your PC shipped with 4 GB of RAM or more with Windows preinstalled, then its 64bit) or Windows 8 Pro x64 as your OS. Win8Pro is recommended, as the main os, due to Windows 7 not being officially supported for the SDK that has the deployment tool you need.
The third thing that's needed is the Windows Phone 8 SDK (Software Development Kit). It includes a Windows Phone emulator for WP7 and WP8.
The fourth requirement is kinda optional as it depends if you are planning on utilizing the WP8 emulator. The requirement is for your CPU to be SLAT compatible. This is solely due to the WP8 emulator utilizing Hyper-V on Win8.
Finally, you just sign in to the Registration app with your phone plugged in making sure the screen is unlocked first.
thals1992 said:
Then you need to download SysApp Pusher from the store. With that app you can check that extras+info is up to date.
EDIT: I'm just going back through the other posts.
To deploy xaps, either need to use a student email account to signup for Dreamspark or just pay $20 or whatever it in your local currency. Both of those gets you a Microsoft Developer account to develop apps and as a side effect, you can add your phone for developer access.
The second thing required is either Windows 7 x64 (If your PC shipped with 4 GB of RAM or more with Windows preinstalled, then its 64bit) or Windows 8 Pro x64 as your OS. Win8Pro is recommended, as the main os, due to Windows 7 not being officially supported for the SDK that has the deployment tool you need.
The third thing that's needed is the Windows Phone 8 SDK (Software Development Kit). It includes a Windows Phone emulator for WP7 and WP8.
The fourth requirement is kinda optional as it depends if you are planning on utilizing the WP8 emulator. The requirement is for your CPU to be SLAT compatible. This is solely due to the WP8 emulator utilizing Hyper-V on Win8.
Finally, you just sign in to the Registration app with your phone plugged in making sure the screen is unlocked first.
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Click to collapse
Thank you very much!!! I have dreamspark account but i found that i will be able to dev unlock my phone via windowsphone...
However when i launch it is just some pretemplate solution no c# or XAML coding at all... I would not like to use my MSDNAA account because it says that i only got one year to develop and honestly i just started studying IT at faculty and i do not know so much stuff about C#.
Anyways, after i eventually do that how do i launch directly field test from cpu's guy utility? Is there some adress for it?
Yes. use the string from the diagnostic thread and enter 3282 for the dial code portion.
You can get a jump start with their developing for beginners series.
Hey, I have just tried windows 10 for phones and didn't really like it. Some features are awesome, but for me they are mostly apps, like music player, edge browser and the new office. But speaking about the design... Not that I don't understand that it is still unfinished, I just don't like the way Microsoft goes, I prefer old good WP 8.1 and I am not sure if I will update, especially looking at the fact that we have an interop unlock now So is there any way to install these apps on wp8.1? They look like ordinary appx files and I don't think that there are new drivers and stuff that will prevent us from doing it.
no, they use a new updated RT Runtime with new functions which are not available on Windows Phone 8.1.
I'll also stay at Phone 8.1, because I don't like the new Android/iOS UI of Windows 10 Mobile.
Correct. Even if the developer doesn't actually use any W10M functions in their app, if the app targets W10M it won't work on older releases.
However, I expect people will be relatively slow to upgrade to the new runtime - there's still occasionally apps coming out that work on WP7.5, much less WP8.0 - so staying on 8.1 should be a viable option for a while.
Of course, it would be nice if we could simply avoid the new UI if we want to...
In the future, can discover how to root / jailbreak Windows 10 mobile without opening programs?
I would like that the system Windows 10 mobile
can be like the android with root system you have everything you want
then why you not use Android... WP is system for people who dont want Android bloatware, malware and lags... is reason why WP dont have this
@dxdy
thanks for your answer
I understand what you say
but I really like WP10
I was lucky to use some Android phones
but I have now decided to use WP10 but, strange everything I could do with my old phone android
I wonder
WP10 someday be like android?
root / jailbreak
Where each user installs what you want and thanks to all developers
Just activate developer mode.. Dooh....
I think developer mode (now can be enabled going to the phone setup) is more than enough. if you want to do so much changes to the system maybe you should consider going to the Android world.