Ordered my OnePlus last week (I'm upgrading from a Moto X 2015 Pure) and I'm looking forward to getting it. I've been looking over various reviews and came across this one by AnandTech, regarding the display color/accuracy:
http://www.anandtech.com/show/10411/the-oneplus-3-review/4
The OnePlus doesn't score very high on the benchmarks that were used, but what I'm curious about is why OnePlus chose to render NTSC color space, instead of the more widely accepted RGB standard?
The author of the review states:
"After reaching out to OnePlus, explaining why the choice of the NTSC color space as a target doesn't make any sense, and showing the errors it causes with sRGB rendition, they told me that they now intend to offer an sRGB mode as an option in an upcoming OTA update."
Is this something that can be tweaked once I get the phone or will I have to wait? I know color accuracy may not be a big deal to many of you, a lot displays are overly saturated straight from factory anyways, but I've also been seeing reports of green tint etc by various reviews/users. I just wanted to post this information here and wanted to know what your thoughts/opinions are about this.
I feel the display has more of a blue tint than a green.
Some of the issues can be fixed through software, imo. Not all.
The display as it is, isn't as bad as that suggests. But it could be improved for sure. I think they've tried to oversaturate to compensate for the panel.
I think this was a gamble to actually appeal to more customers. This is not very surprising. TVs in the store also often have "presentation" mode with very vivid color (not correct ones) to catch peoples attention. Only those who care calibrate later for best color reproduction. In the store, vivid picture sells the device. Before technical analyses came out, there were plenty of reviews (if not all) saying how good display looks. Most were saying that sure, it would be good to have 2K, but this 1080 screen still looks great, etc. No complaints about color.
I think many people would point and say that screen with very vivid colors looks better next to perfectly calibrated (not so vivid screen). That is just how it is. For a company (Oneplus) that depends on internet sales (not sales through carriers) it probably wasn't a good decision after all. With so much hype and scrutiny going around "sRGB mode as an option" probably should've been there to begin with, so technical people have less to complain about and pop out colors crowd had their treat as well.
Droff said:
I think this was a gamble to actually appeal to more customers. This is not very surprising. TVs in the store also often have "presentation" mode with very vivid color (not correct ones) to catch peoples attention. Only those who care calibrate later for best color reproduction. In the store, vivid picture sells the device. Before technical analyses came out, there were plenty of reviews (if not all) saying how good display looks. Most were saying that sure, it would be good to have 2K, but this 1080 screen still looks great, etc. No complaints about color.
I think many people would point and say that screen with very vivid colors looks better next to perfectly calibrated (not so vivid screen). That is just how it is. For a company (Oneplus) that depends on internet sales (not sales through carriers) it probably wasn't a good decision after all. With so much hype and scrutiny going around "sRGB mode as an option" probably should've been there to begin with, so technical people have less to complain about and pop out colors crowd had their treat as well.
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Yep. The panel definitely isn't bad quality. Anandtech gave it a poor review based on the calibration, not the quality of the actual panel itself. I can appreciate accurate displays and typically prefer them, but I can tell you this, most people will think the OnePlus 3 display looks great. The colors look about the same as the default adaptive display mode of the Note 5 and Galaxy S7, but the white balance is actually better (my OP3 has less green tint than my S7 Edge). If the Galaxy S7 didn't have the basic mode display setting that no one actually enables, Anandtech would have given it just as bad of a review as they gave the OnePlus 3.
As for sharpness, it's a non-issue. You can't even tell it's lower resolution than the S7 Edge unless you bring the phone about 6 inches from you face, and even then, it's not easy to tell.
Brightness is good too. I compared it to my S7 Edge out in sunlight today and the S7 Edge was only slightly brighter. Both were easily readable though.
At this point, I am leaning towards going back to the S7 Edge and returning the OP3, but it's not an easy decision. I have changed my mind back and forth several times. If I didn't already own an S7 Edge and was deciding between paying $800 or $400, it would be an easy choice... the OnePlus 3. It is soo close to providing an experience just as good as the S7 Edge. There are only a few small areas in which it falls a little bit behind, but those small improvements aren't worth double the price.
gtg465x said:
Yep. The panel definitely isn't bad quality. Anandtech gave it a poor review based on the calibration, not the quality of the actual panel itself. I can appreciate accurate displays and typically prefer them, but I can tell you this, most people will think the OnePlus 3 display looks great. The colors look about the same as the default adaptive display mode of the Note 5 and Galaxy S7, but the white balance is actually better (my OP3 has less green tint than my S7 Edge). If the Galaxy S7 didn't have the basic mode display setting that no one actually enables, Anandtech would have given it just as bad of a review as they gave the OnePlus 3.
As for sharpness, it's a non-issue. You can't even tell it's lower resolution than the S7 Edge unless you bring the phone about 6 inches from you face, and even then, it's not easy to tell.
Brightness is good too. I compared it to my S7 Edge out in sunlight today and the S7 Edge was only slightly brighter. Both were easily readable though.
At this point, I am leaning towards going back to the S7 Edge and returning the OP3, but it's not an easy decision. I have changed my mind back and forth several times. If I didn't already own an S7 Edge and was deciding between paying $800 or $400, it would be an easy choice... the OnePlus 3. It is soo close to providing an experience just as good as the S7 Edge. There are only a few small areas in which it falls a little bit behind, but those small improvements aren't worth double the price.
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can you discern individual pixels because of the pentile technology that is used? that's really crucial. I'm not really bothered by some inaccuracies that the display might have. I'm using my note 4 with adaptive display which for sure is not accurate but i do like it. I think those innacuracies can be fixed with an OTA display profile or some tweaking with custom kernel. But pixelation cannot be fixed. So there you have it. Could you discern individual pixels. Ty for your review
gtg465x said:
Yep. The panel definitely isn't bad quality. Anandtech gave it a poor review based on the calibration, not the quality of the actual panel itself. I can appreciate accurate displays and typically prefer them, but I can tell you this, most people will think the OnePlus 3 display looks great. The colors look about the same as the default adaptive display mode of the Note 5 and Galaxy S7, but the white balance is actually better (my OP3 has less green tint than my S7 Edge). If the Galaxy S7 didn't have the basic mode display setting that no one actually enables, Anandtech would have given it just as bad of a review as they gave the OnePlus 3.
As for sharpness, it's a non-issue. You can't even tell it's lower resolution than the S7 Edge unless you bring the phone about 6 inches from you face, and even then, it's not easy to tell.
Brightness is good too. I compared it to my S7 Edge out in sunlight today and the S7 Edge was only slightly brighter. Both were easily readable though.
At this point, I am leaning towards going back to the S7 Edge and returning the OP3, but it's not an easy decision. I have changed my mind back and forth several times. If I didn't already own an S7 Edge and was deciding between paying $800 or $400, it would be an easy choice... the OnePlus 3. It is soo close to providing an experience just as good as the S7 Edge. There are only a few small areas in which it falls a little bit behind, but those small improvements aren't worth double the price.
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Thank you for your input, it is much appreciated. I should be receiving my OP3 by the end of this week, can't wait!
gtg465x said:
Yep. The panel definitely isn't bad quality. Anandtech gave it a poor review based on the calibration, not the quality of the actual panel itself. I can appreciate accurate displays and typically prefer them, but I can tell you this, most people will think the OnePlus 3 display looks great.
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Note: long post, a bit off topic, but mostly about the display.
I was very worried about this, especially as I already on OP2 and was wondering whether I should get the OP3. According to anandtech, OP3 is amazing in everything other than the screen calibration, just like the OP2. So thanks for the clarification. :highfive: It's annoying that they didn't cover some topics like audio/DAC quality and community development support. The amount of source code released is staggering, on par with a Nexus, even dash charge will work as they will release the binaries as stated on their GitHub. We got our first custom rom within an hour of the op3 announcement, which I believe is a new record. Many famous devs from other devices are moving to the OP3, like arter97, DespairFactor and sultanxda. And we already have grarak.
But I was also wondering(since I don't have a spectrophotometer) whether the default color profile on custom roms for the op2 and op3 are accurate or whether they are same as stock. I tried the threads, but couldn't find a satisfactory answer. I assume with kcal it could be fixed, but atleast for the OP2 I have found no color profiles that claim to have been a result of accurate calibration using a spectrophotometer. So I just boosted the saturation a tiny bit and it looks much better. You are right that the display looks good though, but users will never know the difference if they aren't exposed to accurate colors right? I wonder how anandtech knows that the display colors seem off just by looking at it.
And like the other user said, this is actually odd because oneplus sells through the internet, not retail, so they have no incentive to calibrate to appear "vivid", whatever that's supposed to mean. So I basically don't understand why oneplus would choose to calibrate their display like this.
About the resolution, atleast on my OP2 and a friend's Galaxy note 5(stock, friend isn't a power user) compared side to side(at different viewing distances), I could tell that the note 5 display was way better/sharper, atleast to me. And I actually went in expecting my op2 display to be better.
I don't know whether that was because of the colors or actual resolution or something else. I could also notice how freaking blue the op2 display was when we compared high res black and white pictures. To be fair, the black and white pic on the note 5 looked a bit yellow to me.
So to sum up, my questions are,
is the default color profile on custom roms for op2/op3 accurate unlike stock?
If not, is there an easy way to obtain an accurate display on these devices using kcal or something else?
Why do OEMs choose to calibrate displays inaccurately?
Is display accuracy a good thing or bad thing?
Regardless, I am most likely going to purchase an OP3(although I'm still skeptical about the display), since as you said, the numerous advantages dwarf the few minor flaws, and it costs half as much as many flagships. I'm currently in India, but will be going to the US in August to study undergrad computer science (maybe get into Android development as well!). So I'm probably going to have to wait to purchase the north american model instead of the global one for LTE reasons, will have to check. Kinda sucks. I wonder why oems have SO MANY different variants of the same phone(especially Samsung). One reason I can think of is they can't fit in all the LTE and other radios required to support all frequencies/bands without compromising on other parts of the phone.
I personally think a cool phone for some people would be one that has one large compromise, but is near perfect in everything else, like design, performance, and dev support. For example, a phone without cameras, but near perfect in everything else. Maybe if the op3 eliminated the camera and poured that money into the display and other minor flaws, it would have been even better! Just my opinion though.
Edit: hey I just realized, that's the strength of truly modular phones!!! You can choose your own compromises, like no large camera in favour of using that space for a larger battery, or some other combo! Ugh, that was so obvious..
knpk13 said:
Note: long post, a bit off topic, but mostly about the display.
Why do OEMs choose to calibrate displays inaccurately?
Is display accuracy a good thing or bad thing?
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Looks like Carl posted his thoughts on the latest Anandtech review (regarding the display):
"With our relationships in the supply chain, we know the BOM (bill of materials) of all other flagships. Out of all the devices that the OnePlus 3 gets compared to, it is one of, if not the most expensive to make. Do you think the price delta between a 2K AMOLED and a 1080p AMOLED is huge? It's a product decision, and spec by spec is not how to judge a product. The OnePlus 3 uses latest generation AMOLED made to our specifications by Samsung. The vast majority of our users, and reviewers love Optic AMOLED. It is NOT tuned to sRGB, and was never meant to be. sRGB tuning is a niche requirement and is not the right choice for the vast majority of smartphone users. Why do you think it's hidden under developer settings on the 6P? For those who need it, we've taken note, and have added it to the next OTA."
Source: https://forums.oneplus.net/threads/even-carl-tires-of-constant-nitpicking-display-options-forthcoming-on-next-ota.451786/
TritonB7 said:
Looks like Carl posted his thoughts on the latest Anandtech review (regarding the display):
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Interesting. Check out further debate in the comments.
http://www.anandtech.com/comments/10411/the-oneplus-3-review/504784
I'm no expert, but it seems like anandtech sticks to sRGB for a reason. I would not trust any party(oneplus, anandtech, anyone else) too much until I have more info. But you have to admit anandtech seem slightly more trustworthy since they give you "real" reasons and are a 3rd party reviewer unlike oneplus. Carl's reason was just that people like it and sRGB is not the standard(no reason provided). He didn't even respond to the usage of pentile amoled(last used in the Galaxy note 3 I believe). And im confused as to why he is citing expenses. That does not seem relevant (if we don't take into consideration that higher price means higher quality).
Usually your eyes just adapt to the display regardless of its color accuracy, since I don't think most people can't judge very well whether colors are accurate.(including me)
Thanks for the link though. Wonder when Android when implement some kind of color calibration standard. Or when some kind of metric for smartphone display quality/accuracy will be developed.
---------- Post added at 03:50 PM ---------- Previous post was at 03:39 PM ----------
Here's another link. Note the last paragraph which I've also pasted here in hide quotes.
http://www.anandtech.com/show/7821/color-gamut-in-mobile-and-pcs
Seems pretty unbiased and there really doesn't seem to be any incentive for them to misconstrue their report.
http://gizmodo.com/which-smartphone-and-tablet-displays-show-the-most-accu-1660275228
Ultimately, such quibbles over color gamut and the resultant color accuracy of the display may not be able to override the dominant discourse of subjectively evaluated color in a display, and many people prefer the look of an oversaturated display to that of a properly calibrated one. But within the debates that will undoubtedly take place over such a subject, it is crucial to keep in mind that regardless of personal opinion on display colors, color accuracy is a quantitative, objective analysis of display quality. While subjectively, one may prefer a display that has a color gamut larger than sRGB, objectively, such a display isn't accurate. Of course, including a vivid display profile isn't a problem, but there should always be a display profile that makes for accurate color.
@TritonB7 if you're on the oneplus forums (I'm not), I think it would be interesting if you posted there and linked them here to see what their response is.
---------- Post added at 04:18 PM ---------- Previous post was at 03:50 PM ----------
I hope someone releases a guide on xda or elsewhere, how to calibrate displays accurately using kcal, or publishes a list of calibrated kcal profiles for different phones. Or maybe there already is a guide like that. I'll try searching.
Konskl said:
can you discern individual pixels because of the pentile technology that is used? that's really crucial. I'm not really bothered by some inaccuracies that the display might have. I'm using my note 4 with adaptive display which for sure is not accurate but i do like it. I think those innacuracies can be fixed with an OTA display profile or some tweaking with custom kernel. But pixelation cannot be fixed. So there you have it. Could you discern individual pixels. Ty for your review
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No, definitely not. If I put the phone about 6 inches from my eyes, I can see some very minor jagged edges on curved lines, but definitely not individual pixels. And at 1 foot plus and normal viewing distances it's very hard to tell that the screen is lower resolution than my S7 Edge.
Konskl said:
can you discern individual pixels because of the pentile technology that is used? that's really crucial. I'm not really bothered by some inaccuracies that the display might have. I'm using my note 4 with adaptive display which for sure is not accurate but i do like it. I think those innacuracies can be fixed with an OTA display profile or some tweaking with custom kernel. But pixelation cannot be fixed. So there you have it. Could you discern individual pixels. Ty for your review
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Two more things fixed. http://www.xda-developers.com/oneplus-3-reviewer-ota-brings-srgb-mode-and-ram-adjustments/
I just got my phone yesterday and very impressed with it having come from the Moto X Pure. I do see the display shift to blue hue when viewing the display at an angle, but I rarely ever do that and it's not enough to bother me. Also, I thought I'd link to this review regarding ota 3.1.4 ( you will need to use google translate).
http://www.frandroid.com/marques/oneplus/365110_oneplus-3-oxygenos-3-1-4-mise-a-jour-change
For me, the "Optic AMOLED" is most problematic when it comes to having lots of text on the screen and reading text. Granted, that's an extremely important feature, but I just mean that as far as the experience of playing games, consuming media, looking at and taking pictures, and so on, the average user will probably be happier with an oversaturated display (re: more Samsung-like) than they would be with more faithful color reproduction. It seems like to the layman, oversaturation = better quality display, at least to a degree.
Hey everyone, just wanted to check back in and thank everyone for their thoughts on this matter. I also wanted let you all know that Anandtech just posted an update to their original review regarding the OnePlus3 display, stating:
To say that OnePlus's new sRGB mode provides a substantial improvement in display accuracy would be an understatement. The display has gone from being the most inaccurate display that I've seen in years, to being among the most accurate displays that we have on record.
Source: http://www.anandtech.com/show/10445/revisiting-the-oneplus-3/2
gtg465x said:
No, definitely not. If I put the phone about 6 inches from my eyes, I can see some very minor jagged edges on curved lines, but definitely not individual pixels. And at 1 foot plus and normal viewing distances it's very hard to tell that the screen is lower resolution than my S7 Edge.
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Mmmmh, its not a truly bad panel but view it in horizontal position and the lack of resolution which drops to around 320 PPI is just too apparent. My guess is the panel is a few generations old. Its the most obvious part where costs have been saved and I do wonder about Op' wisdom on this. Other than that its a good phone IMHO.
Triton, that's really great to hear!
Now if just my replacement device (had irregular color hue on screen...) would be here... then I could enjoy this great phone even more!
drummerman said:
Mmmmh, its not a truly bad panel but view it in horizontal position and the lack of resolution which drops to around 320 PPI is just too apparent. My guess is the panel is a few generations old. Its the most obvious part where costs have been saved and I do wonder about Op' wisdom on this. Other than that its a good phone IMHO.
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If it was a few generations old, it would not be accurate or efficient
I can't wait for the update. These updates will bring positivity to OnePlus 3. I'm waiting for update before root.
Sent from my ONEPLUS A3000 using XDA-Developers mobile app
gtg465x said:
Yep. The panel definitely isn't bad quality. Anandtech gave it a poor review based on the calibration, not the quality of the actual panel itself. I can appreciate accurate displays and typically prefer them, but I can tell you this, most people will think the OnePlus 3 display looks great. The colors look about the same as the default adaptive display mode of the Note 5 and Galaxy S7, but the white balance is actually better (my OP3 has less green tint than my S7 Edge). If the Galaxy S7 didn't have the basic mode display setting that no one actually enables, Anandtech would have given it just as bad of a review as they gave the OnePlus 3.
As for sharpness, it's a non-issue. You can't even tell it's lower resolution than the S7 Edge unless you bring the phone about 6 inches from you face, and even then, it's not easy to tell.
Brightness is good too. I compared it to my S7 Edge out in sunlight today and the S7 Edge was only slightly brighter. Both were easily readable though.
At this point, I am leaning towards going back to the S7 Edge and returning the OP3, but it's not an easy decision. I have changed my mind back and forth several times. If I didn't already own an S7 Edge and was deciding between paying $800 or $400, it would be an easy choice... the OnePlus 3. It is soo close to providing an experience just as good as the S7 Edge. There are only a few small areas in which it falls a little bit behind, but those small improvements aren't worth double the price.
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Are you serious? The S7 display is WAY better in every aspect.
brickedvice said:
Are you serious? The S7 display is WAY better in every aspect.
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I'm serious. I have both phones right here. And I did say that the S7 Edge display is a little brighter and a little sharper, but I don't see how that makes it WAY better, especially now that OnePlus has provided an update that calibrates it to be just as accurate as the S7 display in sRGB mode.
Many aspects are the same. Both are covered in Gorilla Glass 4. They have equal viewing angles. They are both AMOLED and made by Samsung. They both have similarly accurate colors in sRGB mode.
Related
I've heard so many mixed perspectives.
The way I see it, S-OLED should be the best in the bunch.
Followed by OLED and then TFT..
I've heard about the nexus display looking "unnatural" from engadget, whatever that means..
Some people are saying that the upcoming sprint evo 4g has a brighter and simply better (4.3") screen.
Apart from the size, the screen technology is just TFT.
In the computer LCD world, i have heard more bad than good about TFT, so what's the deal?
Right now I have a 24" 1080p TFT LCD Monitor, and I think it's beautiful.
I haven't had much to compare it to though.
It's not the greatest screen I've seen, but it's definitely nice.
I have both an HD2 and a Nexus One. The HD2 has a 4.3" TFT display and looks gorgeous. It doesn't have a very defined pixel grid look that you can see if you stare at your Nexus One up close, so it looks more blended.
On the flip side, the Nexus One's vibrancy is hands down better. While watching movies on the HD2, I loved the size of the image, but to be honest, I prefer the color of the Nexus One's screen.
Outside in the sunlight, the HD2 wins. It still gets horrible glare, but no where near as bad as the Nexus One.
With all of that being said, I prefer the Nexus One's screen. Not going to talk about the size differences and their pros and cons, because that's a separate subject altogether. I'm mostly indoors for my job, and being a graphics designer, I enjoy the contrast that the OLED screen can deliver. It's not exactly color accurate, but since this is a phone and not being used as a design device, it doesn't matter...it looks gorgeous. So long as people don't appear as orange aliens, I enjoy the contrast. (Go stare at some of the TVs on display in major retail stores...they jack the contrast up to ridiculous levels to try to wow the viewer, but make things look downright stupid)
I see, that's pretty much like I expected.
The OLED displays will have a more pixel grid display because each pixel is actually a tiny LED. For me that's fine, as long as its not blatant.
So then the best choice would probably be AMOLED that's good in sunlight aka super amoled.
Have you tried playing with the brightness in the sunlight?
I haven't actually experienced an amoled screen yet, but i would think that if you turned the brightness up to max it would like quite okay in the sun.
At least that's how my G1 (TFT LCD) was.
Thanks for the input btw!
From the start I could not understand the positive voices for the AMOLED display. I had a Galaxy and I hated it. Now I have the Nexus and I hate the UNNATURAL colours. They are ghastly! If I had the choice between a Nexus with TFT or AMOLED screen I would certainly pick a TFT.
azalex86 said:
I have both an HD2 and a Nexus One. The HD2 has a 4.3" TFT display and looks gorgeous. It doesn't have a very defined pixel grid look that you can see if you stare at your Nexus One up close, so it looks more blended.
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isnt the supersonics screen a little brighter and more vibrant than the hd2? it sure seemed soo in the pictures and videos i saw
I have the two available high-end android devices - the Milestone (GSM version of the Droid, though with non-unlockable bootloader :-( ) and the Nexus One.
The 'stone has a 854x480 TFT, and the N1 has an 800x480 AMOLED.
Inside, the N1 screen wins - it is incredibly bright, less battery hungry, and has notably better contrast. The Milestone is good, but the N1 is better.
Another N1 advantage is that, even though both screens are 3.7 inches, the milestone is taller and narrower in portrait mode, making the portrait-mode keyboard harder to use for those of us with freakishly-large hands.
Outside, however, it just isn't even close. The Milestone is the best color screen I've ever seen on a large screen phone under bright light. It is absolutely usable in bright sunlight - you can take photos, check out a youtube video, read your RSS feeds, tweets, maps, whatever with absolutely no problem at all. The N1 is almost unusable in direct sunlight - there is just too much glare from the substrate and touch layers. And if you are also wearing sunglasses, forget it, you can't see a thing. Even an iPhone 3GS or iPod Touch (3rd gen) are mush less readable in bright conditions than the Milestone.
Samsung's new S-AMOLED is meant to bond the touch layer into the AMOLED surface directly, taking out a glare / difraction / etc. layer, and making the screen good in bright light. I have my doubts that it will be as good as a strong TFT in those conditions, but we'll see. It will certainly be thinner, better indoors and less power hungry
I don't have yet a N1 but I had the samsung Jet back in fall ,it had an amoled screen. It was quite good under sunlight,colors are washed out but you can clearly read SMS text or use the menu.
Now playing games in summer at the beach at 12am...forget about it and try take spy pics of string gurls with your 5mp
topdnbass said:
I see, that's pretty much like I expected.
The OLED displays will have a more pixel grid display because each pixel is actually a tiny LED. For me that's fine, as long as its not blatant.
So then the best choice would probably be AMOLED that's good in sunlight aka super amoled.
Have you tried playing with the brightness in the sunlight?
I haven't actually experienced an amoled screen yet, but i would think that if you turned the brightness up to max it would like quite okay in the sun.
At least that's how my G1 (TFT LCD) was.
Thanks for the input btw!
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Yeah, even with the Nexus One set to 100%, the readability is around the HD2 with 50-60% brightness outside. Thankfully it is only a problem in direct sunlight.
bobdude5 said:
isnt the supersonics screen a little brighter and more vibrant than the hd2? it sure seemed soo in the pictures and videos i saw
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I believe they are the same screen in both devices, but could be wrong. We'll have to wait until they can do a proper side by side with the exact same lightness settings.
A 4.3" Super AMOLED screen would be nice. I would never buy a phone with a bigger display than that, because it would become uncomfortable to use, and at that point, you might as well just buy a tablet.
Settembrini said:
From the start I could not understand the positive voices for the AMOLED display. I had a Galaxy and I hated it. Now I have the Nexus and I hate the UNNATURAL colours. They are ghastly! If I had the choice between a Nexus with TFT or AMOLED screen I would certainly pick a TFT.
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I would suggest you have a screen that is defective if it has really noticeable colour deviations.
Obviously it's not a properly colour calibrated display, but everything looks perfectly natural on mine (skin tones etc), with no significant over saturation or hue shifts.
yeah, I'm a big outdoor guy and not looking forward to dealing with this screen outdoors....sucks.
Whatever happened to transflective technology...loved that on my old tilt.
Guys, aren't there screen cover/protectors that deflect or whatever and that make the screen readable in sunlight?
thanks
rockky said:
yeah, I'm a big outdoor guy and not looking forward to dealing with this screen outdoors....sucks.
Whatever happened to transflective technology...loved that on my old tilt.
Guys, aren't there screen cover/protectors that deflect or whatever and that make the screen readable in sunlight?
thanks
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There are anti-glare protectors that help eliminate some of the glare by dispursing it better, but even then it's still pretty bad. The main issue is due to having no backlight like a TFT.
GlenH said:
I would suggest you have a screen that is defective if it has really noticeable colour deviations.
Obviously it's not a properly colour calibrated display, but everything looks perfectly natural on mine (skin tones etc), with no significant over saturation or hue shifts.
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No, there is nothing wrong with the colour calibration. Girlfriend has also got a Nexus and I have seen others and even on photos here on the internet you can see the unnatural colours of the screen.
Have a look at the first post where you can find the question, if it were true that the colours are unnatural referring to Engadget. And yes, the colours are unnatural. I like the Nexus, do not get me wrong, but I do not like the colours of AMOLED screens. They are awful.
rockky said:
yeah, I'm a big outdoor guy and not looking forward to dealing with this screen outdoors....sucks.
Whatever happened to transflective technology...loved that on my old tilt.
Guys, aren't there screen cover/protectors that deflect or whatever and that make the screen readable in sunlight?
thanks
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There are definitely protectors that do that, but I don't like the feel of anything but glass on a touch screen.. That's just me though.
Hey I noticed in your sig that you have an iphone and nexus, how would you compare the two? The screen and everything else (you should make another thread for that though).
azalex86 said:
Yeah, even with the Nexus One set to 100%, the readability is around the HD2 with 50-60% brightness outside. Thankfully it is only a problem in direct sunlight.
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Click to collapse
Damn that's pretty bad, cause with the TFT on my G1 I always had to turn it up to max to get a decent display.
So assuming the HD2 is similar (same technology), then AMOLED must be pretty bad in sunlight.
vegetaleb said:
I don't have yet a N1 but I had the samsung Jet back in fall ,it had an amoled screen. It was quite good under sunlight,colors are washed out but you can clearly read SMS text or use the menu.
Now playing games in summer at the beach at 12am...forget about it and try take spy pics of string gurls with your 5mp
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Lol, spy pics.
big_adventure said:
I have the two available high-end android devices - the Milestone (GSM version of the Droid, though with non-unlockable bootloader :-( ) and the Nexus One.
The 'stone has a 854x480 TFT, and the N1 has an 800x480 AMOLED.
Inside, the N1 screen wins - it is incredibly bright, less battery hungry, and has notably better contrast. The Milestone is good, but the N1 is better.
Another N1 advantage is that, even though both screens are 3.7 inches, the milestone is taller and narrower in portrait mode, making the portrait-mode keyboard harder to use for those of us with freakishly-large hands.
Outside, however, it just isn't even close. The Milestone is the best color screen I've ever seen on a large screen phone under bright light. It is absolutely usable in bright sunlight - you can take photos, check out a youtube video, read your RSS feeds, tweets, maps, whatever with absolutely no problem at all. The N1 is almost unusable in direct sunlight - there is just too much glare from the substrate and touch layers. And if you are also wearing sunglasses, forget it, you can't see a thing. Even an iPhone 3GS or iPod Touch (3rd gen) are mush less readable in bright conditions than the Milestone.
Samsung's new S-AMOLED is meant to bond the touch layer into the AMOLED surface directly, taking out a glare / difraction / etc. layer, and making the screen good in bright light. I have my doubts that it will be as good as a strong TFT in those conditions, but we'll see. It will certainly be thinner, better indoors and less power hungry
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I know the AMOLED's are pretty great indoors, but when you say incredibly bright... If viewing late at night in bed for example, is it too bright even on the lowest setting?
I'd like a phone that can be very dim or very bright.
Settembrini said:
From the start I could not understand the positive voices for the AMOLED display. I had a Galaxy and I hated it. Now I have the Nexus and I hate the UNNATURAL colours. They are ghastly! If I had the choice between a Nexus with TFT or AMOLED screen I would certainly pick a TFT.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Have you compared side-by-side? I can't believe that they're THAT bad.
@topdnbass
Have you compared side-by-side? I can't believe that they're THAT bad.
Yes, I have. I do it all the time, as I have still a G1 to compare the Nexus with. If it is "THAT bad" I can't say only that I do not like it and that I would certainly prefer a TFT if had the choice.
Why do you think did the guys from Engadget think the colours to be "unnatural"?
In the end it might not matter that much as it doesn't reduce the functions of the gadget. Other people might even like it, I do not.
S.
Settembrini said:
@topdnbass
Have you compared side-by-side? I can't believe that they're THAT bad.
Yes, I have. I do it all the time, as I have still a G1 to compare the Nexus with. If it is "THAT bad" I can't say only that I do not like it and that I would certainly prefer a TFT if had the choice.
Why do you think did the guys from Engadget think the colours to be "unnatural"?
In the end it might not matter that much as it doesn't reduce the functions of the gadget. Other people might even like it, I do not.
S.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
i personally love it..the colors pop out they look gorgeous
Compared to TFT capacitive screens Amoled are less good under sunlight but they are still usable and certainly much more than HTC WM phones like Diamond and Touch HD
Settembrini said:
@topdnbass
Have you compared side-by-side? I can't believe that they're THAT bad.
Yes, I have. I do it all the time, as I have still a G1 to compare the Nexus with. If it is "THAT bad" I can't say only that I do not like it and that I would certainly prefer a TFT if had the choice.
Why do you think did the guys from Engadget think the colours to be "unnatural"?
In the end it might not matter that much as it doesn't reduce the functions of the gadget. Other people might even like it, I do not.
S.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
You seem to put a lot of faith in what Engadget says. I'm not saying that everything is perfectly flat, but I have a few hundred perfectly-exposed photos from my Nikon D90, all taken with pro glass, on my Nexus, and the colors are not bad at all. They are, well, let's call them "well saturated", but nothing remotely unpleasant - to be honest, given the tiny screen (I take photos be be blown up BIG), the saturation is probably an advantage. And they look notably, even considerably better on the N1 than on an iPhone / iPod touch third-gen.
All of that is my opinion - and I like saturated colors. But I also like skin that still looks like skin, and the N1 delivers that to my eyes.
Gee, didn't I say that it is my opinion and that others might think differently? What you call saturated colours I call unnatural and for me and maybe only for me the colours are an eyesore, but I like the Nexus nevertheless.
big_adventure, you gave me a thought.
I think the best way to really compare these technologies is to have the same image of something, like a HQ picture of your skin.
On both of the phones.
Then compare the output to eachother and to the real life color of your skin.
I said to compare to eachother because a cameras snapshot can change the color, flash, settings, and what not.
Sounds stupid, but maybe what some people define as unnatural on a display, is actually quite natural.
Don't compare how the android OS looks, compare an image within the OS.
vegetaleb said:
Now playing games in summer at the beach at 12am...forget about it and try take spy pics of string gurls with your 5mp
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Well, if you are going to be wandering around a beach at midnight you probably won't run into too many girls to take pictures of. And they'd probably notice the flash going off so it wouldn't be much of a "spy shot".
(Edit: To be fair, http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/12-hour_clock#Confusion_at_noon_and_midnight mentions that am/pm by definition don't make any sense for noon and midnight and are thus often confused. But, the sources it quotes that do assign meaning to 12am and 12pm all seem to call 12am midnight and 12pm noon. It's probably why most of the parking signs in SF are now starting to use "12:01am" when they want to talk about late night street cleaning restrictions...that, and the fact that 12am is also ambiguous as to whether it refers to the start of a day or the end of a day...)
This is basically the problem. Does the n4 have Ny advantage over the s3 in the screen department?
I sold my nexus 7 after 2 days of owning it but it waz not due to the screen waz cause I could not justify owning a tablet and a phone. Tablet be comes a burden if you have a good smartphone already.
So trying to decide between a s3 or s3 mini or n4 or even a a xperia. Or htc one x.
I did notice my nexus 7 screen seemed more pleasant than my s2 because the colors looked more natural and were easier on the eyes.
My s2 has broken wifi so I need to sell it as its hardware fault.
I hear the n4 feels like holding a iphone its unibody design feels very expensive and quality.
The colours are fantastic and you can tweak the gamma settings via a custom kernel. My display looks absolutely gorgeous, with way better black levels than normal (but of course, can't beat AMOLED in that department).
AFAIK, AMOLEDs still have the degrading issue so your display will look a bit weird as some parts of the screen will burn out faster than others. It's up to you at the end of the day, i can tell you the N4's display is great out of the bot, but absolutely awesome once you've tweak the gamma settings. You'll also be getting regular, guaranteed updates straight from Google.
Check out the spreadsheet in my sig. Many great color settings there; and after using the bolded set, I now like my display more than my friends AMOLED on his SGSIII
I had the Gnexus before...and honestly, I didn't quite like the display on that.
What I did like was the viewing angles and the black blacks. Everything else was off-balance and saturated.
Oh - and amoled, I hear, are prone to greater degradation (and mine was a bit awful with horizontal lines and what-not).
With IPS, you won't get those deep blacks bit they do the job even at night with a lightbulb on. However, everything else renders fine. And crispier.
Just check out the screen on the One X and the One and you'll see how far ahead IPS is in terms of brightness, sunlight visibility and clarity.
Oh, and the fact that Amoled, when they're not displaying black, consume more power than IPS...
My two cents.
Sent from my upgraded mini tractor.
I had an S2 as well, and its screen doesn't hold a candle to the Nexus 4 IMO.
[DISCUSSION] Google Nexus 4 vs any other phone
Your questions are likely answered here. Please continue discussions in that thread
Closed
For those saying the N5 has a washed out screen i advise you to watch this video
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VlNcuBcnnoU
The N5 has a top notch screen, the viewing angles are abit off but the actual quality is amazing! It clearly outclasses the Xperia Z1, a £450+ phone which only got released recently, and the screen on that is meant to be an improvement on its predecessor the Z1, I feel sorry for the people who bought that O.O
GalaxySN00B:0 said:
For those saying the N5 has a washed out screen i advise you to watch this video
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VlNcuBcnnoU
The N5 has a top notch screen, the viewing angles are abit off but the actual quality is amazing! It clearly outclasses the Xperia Z1, a £450+ phone which only got released recently, and the screen on that is meant to be an improvement on its predecessor the Z1, I feel sorry for the people who bought that O.O
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
To say that the N5's screen is great because it's better than the Z1's isn't saying a whole lot. That's like calling yourself fast bc you're only the 3 slowest kid in gym class. I've had both phones and still currently have my N5. I do find the N5 screen to be dull compared to most phones I've used and compared. That being said, as you raise the brightness the screen does look much nicer. It seems the brightness levels have more to do with it than the actual quality of the screen. The Z1 is a great phone but one plagued by terrible viewing angles. The screen which is still quite nice, isn't the best part of the phone so I wouldn't use it as a base of comparison to build up the N5's screen. I don't put a lot of weight into those "complaint threads" because the phone costs $349-$400, for what you pay you get a pretty good phone.
Sent from my Nexus 5 using Forum Runner
A lot of people confuse over saturation as a nice screen and natural as dull. Since you can't really test the difference on a phone, if your TV has a standard or vivid mode then throw it on that. Then throw the TV into movie mode. It would look dull at first but that is the closest picture to a calibrated level you will get out of the box. Once your eyes adjust to that picture, then try going back to standard mode. You will never be able to watch an over saturated fake picture again.
Look at the picture in a movie theater, you can call that dull as well but these is what natural and real life look like.
Now, if they boosted up the contrast, that would improve the screen.
looks like we need someone with calibration equipment to do some testing. i mean compared to a samsung with whatever the latest iteration of amoled screen most do look dull. that doesn't mean the samsung is better. samsung tends to artificailly over saturate the colors and they usually have a high color temp and sometimes a green tint.
any photographers or printers out there willing to test the screen?
Dani897 said:
looks like we need someone with calibration equipment to do some testing. i mean compared to a samsung with whatever the latest iteration of amoled screen most do look dull. that doesn't mean the samsung is better. samsung tends to artificailly over saturate the colors and they usually have a high color temp and sometimes a green tint.
any photographers or printers out there willing to test the screen?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I'm really looking forward to the inevitable Anandtech review of this phone. Their reviews are almost absurdly detailed and they have lots of great, objective data.
Next to my Moto X and Note 3, my Nexus 5 DOES look washed out. That's the AMOLED effect.
I compared it to both my Nexus 7 and iPad Air and it looks almost identical. Almost every review I have seen claims that it is "washed out", but I'm beginning to think it's just a color neutral LCD screen.
Angeloftech (check out her youtube channel) does some very extensive screen tests in her reviews and talks about the calibration and what the numbers mean. She hasn't released her Nexus 5 review yet, but I suspect it's due any day. That will give us a little better indication of what this screen is about. For example, she called out the LG G2 as being oversaturated and nowhere near accurate. That screen looks great to me, but the tests don't lie. I think we have just become accustomed to oversaturated screens and it's skewing our perspective a little.
The colours are fine it's the white balance that's off it's too warm.
greyhulk said:
Next to my Moto X and Note 3, my Nexus 5 DOES look washed out. That's the AMOLED effect.
I compared it to both my Nexus 7 and iPad Air and it looks almost identical. Almost every review I have seen claims that it is "washed out", but I'm beginning to think it's just a color neutral LCD screen.
Angeloftech (check out her youtube channel) does some very extensive screen tests in her reviews and talks about the calibration and what the numbers mean. She hasn't released her Nexus 5 review yet, but I suspect it's due any day. That will give us a little better indication of what this screen is about. For example, she called out the LG G2 as being oversaturated and nowhere near accurate. That screen looks great to me, but the tests don't lie. I think we have just become accustomed to oversaturated screens and it's skewing our perspective a little.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
You can have a "natural" colors and still have a "dull" or washed out screen. This isn't simply a case of AMOLED over saturation vs N5 and it's "natural" colors. My HTC Butterfly to me has the best screen I've seen. Mind you I own a 5S, Note 3, Butterfly S and N5 all currently. Its color reproduction, saturation, viewing angles and clarity to me best the others. The N5's colors are closer to "natural " then AMOLEDS however that being said is still on the dull side. The note has a clear, bright screen and tends to have improved the cartoonish saturation effect especially when in Movie Mode. Overall I think the N5's screen is OK but not my favorite.
Sent from my Nexus 5 using Forum Runner
Her reviews make many of the big boys look like novice fanboys. She does in depth testing with LOTS of real world use reports. She takes the time to actually use these things and not be the first out the door with a review. Most importantly, she will put the screen under a scope so we can see what is going on. The nexus 5 screen to me looks amazing, very reminiscent of the calibration apple uses. Compared o the broken calibration that was the nexus 4, I think it is great.
Sent from my Nexus 5 using xda app-developers app
Nexus 5 is coming with 2 different panels
There are users who ordered 2 phones and these are different screen, one of them washed colors and yellow whites and the other is more cold and real whites like nexus 4
I prefer nexus 4 cause white is real white not sepia
Enviado desde mi GT-N5110 mediante Tapatalk
fjavierm said:
Nexus 5 is coming with 2 different panels
There are users who ordered 2 phones and these are different screen, one of them washed colors and yellow whites and the other is more cold and real whites like nexus 4
I prefer nexus 4 cause white is real white not sepia
Enviado desde mi GT-N5110 mediante Tapatalk
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
This wouldn't entirely surprise me. I've been scratching my heads about the threads about the yellow whites. I believe some people are experiencing it, especially since people have provided pictures. The white on my phone is a neutral or slightly cool white.
No yellow colors here. my xperia t has a more yellowish screen + is washed out a lot more
As far as I have used this device for a week, it seems color temperature is a bit too high. I hope there will be some kernels that has color temperature options.
Dani897 said:
looks like we need someone with calibration equipment to do some testing. i mean compared to a samsung with whatever the latest iteration of amoled screen most do look dull. that doesn't mean the samsung is better. samsung tends to artificailly over saturate the colors and they usually have a high color temp and sometimes a green tint.
any photographers or printers out there willing to test the screen?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
There was already a calibration test done. There is a link somewhere in one of these threads. It tested that the N5 had the closest colors to reference out of all the phones they tested. Maybe someone will find the link and post it here. They also tested brightness and contrast.
It was the contest that is scored towards the bottom of all the phones they tested.
greyhulk said:
Next to my Moto X and Note 3, my Nexus 5 DOES look washed out. That's the AMOLED effect.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Exactly. You can't go comparing Amoled against ISP. There two totally different technologies. When I compare the N5 to other ISP phones mine looks pretty damn good. Like any LCD though I will calibrate it to my taste once the kernels allow for that. This whole thread is literally "in the eye of the beholder."
I've seen 2 different Nexus 5 units here in Canada (at Virgin Mobile kiosks) and in both cases the colors were accurate and very good, though the
whites are a slight bit on the yellowish/warm side. Compared to an iPhone 5S, the whites on the 5S are brighter and cooler.
Well, the good news is that franco kernel is well under development (according to the original nexus development thread) and once it's complete, we should be able to use his app (Display Control) to calibrate the screen if we want to.
Here are a couple of tests run on the N5 and some other flagships and the results. Link pulled from another thread here.
http://translate.google.co.uk/trans...s-schermkwaliteit-scherp-en-dik-in-orde.html
[email protected] said:
Here are a couple of tests run on the N5 and some other flagships and the results. Link pulled from another thread here.
http://translate.google.co.uk/translate?sl=auto&tl=en&u=http%3A//tweakers.net/reviews/3298/7/google-nexus-5-toptelefoon-met-scherpe-prijs-schermkwaliteit-scherp-en-dik-in-orde.html%0A
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Lol I read the article and wondered why it was written in English but read like the auther was drunk until I saw the web address and saw translate. Good read though, points are easily understood and sum up the comments of most.
Sent from my HTC Butterfly s using Forum Runner
i think comparing the Z1 to N5 isnt fair anyway.
So what if the screen on the N5 is technically better? I've used both and...i didnt think the Z1 screen was that bad really. And viewing angles?
How many people use a personal device tilted to the sides? Most people are going to be looking straight at the thing when they're using it, 100% for me, it's a personal device and i'd be rather happy if others couldnt see whats on the screen.
And also "the Xperia Z1, a £450+ phone which only got released recently, and the screen on that is meant to be an improvement on its predecessor the Z1, I feel sorry for the people who bought that O.O"
really.
Feel sorry for the people who bought a very solid and well build phone?
Feel sorry for the people who dont have rattling buttons?
Feel sorry for the people who can happily drop it down a toilet and still have a functioning phone?
Feel sorry for the people who have a camera that's superbly better than the nexus 5?
Well done there mate.
As some of the Note3 members may remember, I made a big thread in Note3 General Forum in regard to the display quality of the Note3,
you can find it here: http://forum.xda-developers.com/showthread.php?t=2463786
Also, I made similar ones on note2 and generally about AMOLED development over time.
So, as I got my new Note4 (Snapdragon) yesterday (from Amazon Germany), it's time to take a closer look on the AMOLED of this brand
new device.
My first impressions are:
The display is overall way better in terms of color shift when tilting the screen, but:
At least on my first device there is a noticable shift in brightness on the right side of the screen, especially on the lower half of the screen.
On dark grey backgrounds (as for example the XDA app with the dark theme has) you can see a contrast or brightness loss on the lower
right corner.
But my unit has an other, more dramatic flaw: On the left side of the screen, just where the lower end of the volume rocker is located, there
is a 0,5mm area of the screen, where it seems like there is something between the screen and the glass, but there is nothing! on light backgrounds
the spot gets darker, on dark backgrounds the spot gets brighter > very annoying!!
But I guess this is a non common flaw, which is really bad luck and has nothing to do with the uneveness mentioned above.
The funny thing is, this time I really thought I wouldn't have to switch devices, because the screen is otherwise really fine, but the spot-flaw
ruins it for me...
So I ordered a replacement today at amazon, as soon as I have this second device I can compare the two in regard to the AMOLED quality,
and then I will update this post!
What are your first experiences with the screen?
Regards,
Markus
Update 19.10.2014
Got my second device on Friday, and I've seen a third device from a friend:
My second device has a better screen in regard to uniformity (no darker right side of the screen), but: it is darker and has a slightly red tint when
viewed from the center. Also, the color shift is worse when tilting the device.
When I lay my three devices (note3, 2xnote4) side by side, enter *#0*# and compare the screens (walking around, looking from different angles),
then my hand-selected note3 has FAR the best performance in terms of neutral white, and tilting color shift is much less then on both note4.
the device from my friend has a worser red tint when looking straight on, but again tilting performance is better then my second device (although
not as good as on my note3)
conclusio so far:
.) note4 has worser tilting performance (color shift when tilting the device) as note3 (maybe due to higher PPI)
.) again, there are huge differences between different devices >> display lottery is back once again!
Update 02.11.2014:
After seeing a lot more of Note4 devices I'm now finally sure that on Note4 the displays vary a lot. "Perfect screens" are very rare, the best one
I've seen so far was on display in a "MediaMarkt" Store in VIenna. It was a display unit (without radio module), but the screen was a lot better then
on my current Note4. White was much more stable when tilting the device...
Today I had the idea of writing to "DisplayMate", because they tested a lot of Samsung AMOLED devices and their reviews always praise this screens
very much. Would be interesting what they would say to our issues:
Here is the mail I wrote them:
Von: TML1504
Gesendet: Sonntag, 02. November 2014 22:25
An: '[email protected]'
Betreff: Samsung Note4 Display Quality (XDA)
Wichtigkeit: Hoch
Dear ladies and gentlemen,
I’m writing to you because you compare and evaluate display devices and rate their screens.
I know your evaluations since years, and I like your scientific approach.
Let me give you a short description of myself:
I’m a consumer electronics freak with a plethora of devices, mostly from Samsung (I do not like
Apples overestimated marketing crap) and I’m especially a freak when it comes to displays. I
owned several AMOLED devices so far (Galaxy S1, S2, S3, Note1-4, Tab7-7, Tab-S(both)) and with
ALL of them I have to exchange them 2-8 (!) times to get one with a decent screen. Trust me, the
devices you get are cherry-picked from Samsung, or if you bought them randomly you must have
been VERY lucky!
I’ve a MSc in engineering and I hold product development lectures at university, so I know what
I’m talking about tech und manufacturing. Believe me, Samsung has big issues when it comes to
display quality. Their luck is that most people do not compare identical devices, therefore most
people would think their screen is ok and not bother.
So, what is the problem:
As you can see here on XDA developers:
http://forum.xda-developers.com/note-4/help/2-white-tones-screen-t2926527
http://forum.xda-developers.com/note-4/general/colour-tint-screen-t2909552
There are some threads in regard to this problem, as well as pictures.
I for myself created one huge thread for Note4:http://forum.xda-developers.com/note-4/general/note4-amoled-screen-quality-t2906365
And for Note3 as well: http://forum.xda-developers.com/showthread.php?t=2463786
If you search you would find a lot of other threads in regard to Samsung’s AMOLED screens.
In short: The displays of otherwise identical units differ A LOT in terms of display quality. If you
buy 10 Note4 devices you will get perhaps 1-2 with a perfect screen, all other devices would
suffer from bad viewing angles (HUGE discoloration when tilting), uneven brightness distribution
(yellow corners, especially right side of the screen and lower half), or very different white tone
when straight viewing on. I did this since note2 this way: Purchase a few devices, select the one
with the best screen and return the others.
I think this has mainly two manufacturing reasons:
1) The panels are cut out of a wafer. Screens from the center of the wafer are perfect, screens
from the side regions suffer from uneven color and/or brightness distribution depending from
where of the wafer they have been cut
2) Uneven or otherwise not proper coating of the screen. A too thick layer perhaps could cause color
problems.
Nevertheless, what bothers me a little bit is that you do not mention any of this in your reviews, and
people think they have a perfect screen. It would be nice if you response to this issues and at least tell
us what your opinion about the reason for such huge quality issues is.
I will post this mail also on XDA, if you want to you can reply directly there.
Thank you for your otherwise brilliant work!
Best regards,
Markus
Update 11.11.2014: Reply from displaymate
Von: DisplayMate Support <[email protected]>
Gesendet: Montag, 10. November 2014 16:25
An: Markus
Betreff: Re: Samsung Note4 Display Quality (XDA)
Thanks for your Email. Feel free to post this.
We get many Emails like yours with every display review article that we publish, with readers sending in comments and sometimes screen shots of their display, or even multiple displays side-by-side to accentuate the differences.
For our public article series we publish the results that we obtain. There is no question that there are always some defective units, substandard calibrations, variations between production lots and within production lots, variations in display performance, variations between displays from multiple suppliers and manufactured in different factories. We have no way to evaluate the scale, frequency, and validity of these issues based on reader Emails so we don't discuss them. All products, from displays to cars, have quality control and variation issues - consumers know this. We simply tell people that if the display is unsatisfactory then return it for exchange or refund.
For LCDs, a well known issue is the variation in the White LEDs used in the backlight - their color, brightness, and power efficiency all vary significantly. Manufacturers pay varying premiums to have the White LEDs pre-sorted into similar performance classes for their products.
We get many more Emails from unhappy iPhone and iPad customers than any other manufacturer. One possible source is that Apple uses many different suppliers for their displays. However, over a one year product cycle we may test a dozen iPhone and iPad units that are sent to us from multiple sources (including Apple competitors), and over many years we have never found any significant variations in display performance in our lab tests. I don't doubt that there are always some quality control and performance variations, but we have never seen any in the large number of Apple products that we have tested.
We don't get many Emails regarding Samsung OLED displays. Most seem to be the result of the sender leaving it in one of the default Vivid modes instead of the accurate (Cinema, Movie or Basic) mode that we use in our tests. Samsung is a single source manufacturer so that is not an issue. We also test many Samsung OLED devices (including many supplied by Samsung competitors) and have never seen any significant display performance variations within a given model. Again, I don't doubt that there are always some quality control and performance variations, but we have never seen any in the large number of Samsung OLED products that we have tested.
In any case, for our public article series we publish the display results that we obtain in our lab.
While it is difficult to get an objective statistical measure of the frequency and size of display performance variations, I highly encourage you to publicize this issue, perhaps via a youtube channel that can act as a central clearing house for this display issue.
Raymond Soneira
President of DisplayMate Technologies Corporation
Tel: 603-672-8500 Web: http://www.displaymate.com
TML1504 said:
As some of the Note3 members may remember, I made a big thread in Note3 General Forum in regard to the display quality of the Note3,
you can find it here: http://forum.xda-developers.com/showthread.php?t=2463786
Also, I made similar ones on note2 and generally about AMOLED development over time.
So, as I got my new Note4 (Snapdragon) yesterday (from Amazon Germany), it's time to take a closer look on the AMOLED of this brand
new device.
My first impressions are:
The display is overall way better in terms of color shift when tilting the screen, but:
At least on my first device there is a noticable shift in brightness on the right side of the screen, especially on the lower half of the screen.
On dark grey backgrounds (as for example the XDA app with the dark theme has) you can see a contrast or brightness loss on the lower
right corner.
But my unit has an other, more dramatic flaw: On the left side of the screen, just where the lower end of the volume rocker is located, there
is a 0,5mm area of the screen, where it seems like there is something between the screen and the glass, but there is nothing! on light backgrounds
the spot gets darker, on dark backgrounds the spot gets brighter > very annoying!!
But I guess this is a non common flaw, which is really bad luck and has nothing to do with the uneveness mentioned above.
The funny thing is, this time I really thought I wouldn't have to switch devices, because the screen is otherwise really fine, but the spot-flaw
ruins it for me...
So I ordered a replacement today at amazon, as soon as I have this second device I can compare the two in regard to the AMOLED quality,
and then I will update this post!
What are your first experiences with the screen?
Regards,
Markus
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
what you are describing is called backlight bleeding
hello00 said:
what you are describing is called backlight bleeding
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Erm... What you are describing is completely false. Amoled screens don't have backlights.
Warren.D said:
Erm... What you are describing is completely false. Amoled screens don't have backlights.
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true nvm that
hello00 said:
what you are describing is called backlight bleeding
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Except Amoled has no backlight.
pete4k said:
Except Amoled has no backlight.
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@TML1504, Hey! I do remember your thread at the note 3's forum, was pretty awesome buddy made me change 4 n3's of mine to get a decent display due that that xD 1 thing I'd like to know is does the red still changes to orange even by tilting it a lil bit like on the N3, Ty.
RuchRha said:
@TML1504, Hey! I do remember your thread at the note 3's forum, was pretty awesome buddy made me change 4 n3's of mine to get a decent display due that that xD 1 thing I'd like to know is does the red still changes to orange even by tilting it a lil bit like on the N3, Ty.
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Yes.
RuchRha said:
@TML1504, Hey! I do remember your thread at the note 3's forum, was pretty awesome buddy made me change 4 n3's of mine to get a decent display due that that xD 1 thing I'd like to know is does the red still changes to orange even by tilting it a lil bit like on the N3, Ty.
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Yes it does. The colour shift on the note 4 is bad. I still don't understand why reviews are not really mentioning it.
Sent from my SM-N910U using XDA Free mobile app
Warren.D said:
Yes.
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toadsurfer said:
Yes it does. The colour shift on the note 4 is bad. I still don't understand why reviews are not really mentioning it.
Sent from my SM-N910U using XDA Free mobile app
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Now that's very disappointing :/
RuchRha said:
Now that's very disappointing :/
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Yes it is. For me it almost detracts from all the good points about the screen; no point harping on about perfect colour accuracy if you can only see that when viewing the screen from exactly 90 degrees.
Sent from my SM-N910U using XDA Free mobile app
Yeah..it happen to me also..seem like at the right bottom the screen turn into pink white a bit at white background color..but it much better than my note 3..
Id suppose the same screen issues are on the Note 4 as well, lottery time.. I really like the note 4 due to the design but the lottery makes me think twice but maybe ill get it at a later date I wonder though how good are the dark greys on the Note 4, on the note 3 its terrible.
The screen on my device is flawless, I've loaded up that picture of all the wool and everything stands out clearly and vividly. Red is red and Orange is Orange etc.. if I tilt the screen any direction nothing changes, it's perfect.
I've seen six Note 4 phones in various Best Buy stores. All of them had noticeable shifting of colors when tilting the phone left or right, and it did not take much tilting to notice. I've played the screen lottery too many times with Apple products, and the thought of doing it ever again with any product doesn't make me happy.
I'm currently out of contract and was 100% sure that the Note 4 was my next phone. Now I'm not so sure. I have a lot of tolerance for issues that can come up with this technology, but screen quality is not one of those issues.
Disappointing.
The thing is, when looking at any new device, one of the top complaints seems to be screen quality. If I rule out every device because of screen quality, I'll just be stuck on my S3 forever.
I guess I'm on the fence.
Maybe my eyesight is not so good :laugh:
I had the exact same problem with my first N3 that I got. I took it in to at&t and showed them and they replaced it. You couldn't see it on every "screen" but once you could it was evident that something wasn't right.
I too have this problem with colour shift on my Note 4, Can this issue be fixed with a software update?
I never had this problem on the Note 3
OP updated
Update 19.10.2014
Got my second device on Friday, and I've seen a third device from a friend:
My second device has a better screen in regard to uniformity (no darker right side of the screen), but: it is darker and has a slightly red tint when
viewed from the center. Also, the color shift is worse when tilting the device.
When I lay my three devices (note3, 2xnote4) side by side, enter *#0*# and compare the screens (walking around, looking from different angles),
then my hand-selected note3 has FAR the best performance in terms of neutral white, and tilting color shift is much less then on both note4.
the device from my friend has a worser red tint when looking straight on, but again tilting performance is better then my second device (although
not as good as on my note3)
conclosio so far:
.) note4 has worser tilting performance (color shift when tilting the device) as note3 (maybe due to higher PPI)
.) again, there are huge differences between different devices >> display lottery is back once again!
Can the colour shift be fixed by a update?
Just requested the return of my Mi 8 due to an AMOLED issue.
Shades of dark gray aren't uniform. This is visible in darker environments (like in the bedroom at night).
This is most visible on Reddit dark mode. I can see it on Spotify if I look hard.
---
I'm waiting for the e-commerce store's response. They claim that this has to be validated via their tests.
Also, I'm wondering what my odds are with AMOLED... If I get a replacement, will I get a significantly better display or potentially find another set of issues if I look.
What do you reckon are my odds if I go through with the replacement?
OLED screens in general are more problematic displaying dark shapes of grey compared to IPS panels. This has to do with manufacturing tolerances of individual light-emitting pixels at low current. This, in particular, is the reason why most OLED panels employ PWM (flickering) to control brightness, applying higher current in short pulses compared to applying constant low current. If you search for "LG G Flex 2 screen uniformity", you'll see some pretty extreme example of this.
That said, with each individual OLED panel and depending on your personal tolerances, your luck may vary. My Mi 8 is very acceptable when displaying dark shades of grey (I don't notice the problem even if it is there). If you received my Mi 8, there is a chance you could spot the issue because your personal tolerance of the problem is lower than mine. My wife uses an LG G Flex 2 and never notices the (very real) problem with its display uniformity (I do!)
In other words, most users are happy with their displays, but it does not mean all of them got a perfect one.
anthroplus said:
Just requested the return of my Mi 8 due to an AMOLED issue.
Shades of dark gray aren't uniform. This is visible in darker environments (like in the bedroom at night).
This is most visible on Reddit dark mode. I can see it on Spotify if I look hard.
---
I'm waiting for the e-commerce store's response. They claim that this has to be validated via their tests.
Also, I'm wondering what my odds are with AMOLED... If I get a replacement, will I get a significantly better display or potentially find another set of issues if I look.
What do you reckon are my odds if I go through with the replacement?
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Click to collapse
That's normal. It happens with every AMOLED display. I have a Samsung S8 and it happens in the same way.
It's something common, don't be scared.
Grana_10 said:
That's normal. It happens with every AMOLED display. I have a Samsung S8 and it happens in the same way.
It's something common, don't be scared.
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Click to collapse
That's right I have this issue on my note 9 too. My previous note 9 had this and devices in store had this.
Its normal.
anthroplus said:
Just requested the return of my Mi 8 due to an AMOLED issue.
Shades of dark gray aren't uniform. This is visible in darker environments (like in the bedroom at night).
This is most visible on Reddit dark mode. I can see it on Spotify if I look hard.
---
I'm waiting for the e-commerce store's response. They claim that this has to be validated via their tests.
Also, I'm wondering what my odds are with AMOLED... If I get a replacement, will I get a significantly better display or potentially find another set of issues if I look.
What do you reckon are my odds if I go through with the replacement?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
"Aren't uniform" meaning you cannot tell the difference in the shades? Grey is a very challenging and controversial color for AMOLED. Use the Display Tester app by Braintrapp from Google Play and try the "Gamma detection" app when you have your device, you'll see it displayed horizontally. Swipe up and down (with the device of course held horizontally, or "landscape" mode) to change the brightness and look at how it displays grey at different brightness levels. Very weird huh?! It's perfectly normal.
I guess you can say it is a "grey area" for AMOLED...
Crossvxm said:
I would have to say you're in for quite a gamble. Most people aren't keen to spot "defects" on AMOLED displays. I am. Coming from a person who has owned many phones of both main screen technologies, I can tell you that the displays can vary even on identical devices. I've owned Galaxy devices with some having a red hue and others not, same when I had two Nexus 6, one had a slightly red hue and seemingly lower brightness at max, the other was perfect. Sometimes manufacturers have different facilities making the same screen, and differences arise. If you do get a replacement, you just have to hope it's from the better batch.
Now to get a better understanding, what do you mean when you say "aren't uniform?" Could you describe a little what you mean and where/when you notice the issue (e.g. videos, pictures, etc.)
Also, did you attempt to set a static color contrast within the Settings? The display does change tones automatically by default. According to the Display Tester app by Braintrapp from Google Play, it seems that our display does not support Wide Color Gamut. Some of the hues seem to be a tiny bit off according to it on my display, and this is coming from someone who owns a Mi 8 with a "perfect" AMOLED display.
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Every oled screen is uneven, clearly visible on dark gray backround in dark room. Even samsungs don't have perfect screens.
Grana_10 said:
That's normal. It happens with every AMOLED display. I have a Samsung S8 and it happens in the same way.
It's something common, don't be scared.
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Click to collapse
I have the same issue with pixel 2 xl
I've owned the nexus 6p, OnePlus 5, 5t, 6 and the mi 8.
Tbh I think the mi8 has the worst AMOLED display of all of them when it comes to dark backgrounds in low light. It has like a "jelly scrolling" effect
My avatar on YouTube is solid black and I use the dark mode of the YouTube app....when I'm scrolling through comments i leave on videos with the screen brightness down low there's a noticable trailing effect.
It's not enough to make me want to return it but it's a problem I didn't have with any of the other devices I listed.
I prefer AMOLED to LCD any day.
xyourxhighnessx said:
I've owned the nexus 6p, OnePlus 5, 5t, 6 and the mi 8.
Tbh I think the mi8 has the worst AMOLED display of all of them when it comes to dark backgrounds in low light. It has like a "jelly scrolling" effect
My avatar on YouTube is solid black and I use the dark mode of the YouTube app....when I'm scrolling through comments i leave on videos with the screen brightness down low there's a noticable trailing effect.
It's not enough to make me want to return it but it's a problem I didn't have with any of the other devices I listed.
I prefer AMOLED to LCD any day.
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Coming from OnePlus 6, what motivated you to move to the Mi 8?
anthroplus said:
Coming from OnePlus 6, what motivated you to move to the Mi 8?
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I bought the op6 with PayPal credit. I bought two and with the op6t coming I decided to sell them instead of paying the remaining balance. At first I intended to go with 6t but in the end I thought I'd try something different.
Since the Nexus 6p all of my phones have been stock/near stock. I thought I'd try something else. I like stock better because I feel there's a learning curve to miui if you're used to stock but overall I like the mi 8. I wish I would've waited for the mi mix 3 though. The sliding design is nice.
The full screen gesture navigation is the best button free navigation I've tried. I haven't used the buttons since nearly the beginning of owning it. It'll suck when I decide to use a non-xiaomi device. I didn't like OnePlus or stock gesture navigation
well i gotta say, i was afraid to get an bad Screen, too. Especially after reading threads like this. But i can say my screen is perfectly fine. even in lowest brightness. Yes The grays are not that gray as on the screen as on lcd, but thats the same with all amoled screens, and you only see it when u have the exact same app on an lcd screen beside your phone. For the rest its super fine.
Yeah. After 3+ months of using the phone, I’m learning to just enjoy it naturally without nitpicking details that don’t practically affect my everyday experience.
If we treat the phone like a baby, there’s an endless list of concerns.
But if you really just use it like you would (without analyzing scenarios that don’t come naturally), so many of these issues don’t matter at the end of the day.
I think the green is much more problematic on amoled displays (on low brightness / Oled Tool)
Sigray said:
I think the green is much more problematic on amoled displays (on low brightness / Oled Tool)
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That's exactly what I found.
Now, having said that, we don't use oled tools for practical purposes.
I basically don't notice the issue at all under normal use.
In other words, if I never did nitpick at first, 3 years of normal daily use could pass without me noticing the issue at all.