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The guy at ATT store said last week when I bought my Tilt that in order to use it with my laptop I had to pay the extra ($59/month plan instead of the $39 I was hoping for) for my unlimited data plan.
My question is, if though I have the username and password (cause I called them for it) and am using the HTC ROM (instead of the ATT one), do I still need to be paying extra for the "TETHERING" service?
Thanks guys
Nope. Just need to connect your phone using the Internet Sharing program, and you should be good to go.
Blowfish64 said:
Nope. Just need to connect your phone using the Internet Sharing program, and you should be good to go.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
That is not necessarily true. If your data usage pattern (IE, large amounts of data) indicates you are tethering, you will get popped for excess data usage. If your tethering is light, then you should be alright.
Don't assume you can hook up your laptop and go to town web surfing.
While that is true, I think they're pretty lenient with it. I had around a GB of data one month and they didn't care. But yeah, keeping it under the radar is a good rule.
wanted to ask about this
With the 3125 I have I was able to use ICS with the 20 dollar media plan or whatever. I work for different companies and I would use that to get to the net privately. Anyway, I went to another company and I couldn't get ICS to work on that network for some reason.
I'm a developer so I compiled up an internet proxy server to run on the phone. So basically when activesync is not active I could run the server and set my browser to that proxy server. Anyone know if that could avoid tethering? I don't have the proxy running on my Tilt yet. I was going to put a nicer UI on it. I'm wondering if anyone around here would have a use for it.
att as of right now has not been able to catch people tethering other than by exorbant data usage (obviously d/ling 20 GB a month on your kaiser without a tethering plan is going to get you caught), but if it wouldnt take you too long im sure there are a lot of people here who would have a use for that.
adam.hodge said:
With the 3125 I have I was able to use ICS with the 20 dollar media plan or whatever. I work for different companies and I would use that to get to the net privately. Anyway, I went to another company and I couldn't get ICS to work on that network for some reason.
I'm a developer so I compiled up an internet proxy server to run on the phone. So basically when activesync is not active I could run the server and set my browser to that proxy server. Anyone know if that could avoid tethering? I don't have the proxy running on my Tilt yet. I was going to put a nicer UI on it. I'm wondering if anyone around here would have a use for it.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I dont follow... ICs is for when you are out and about and want to use your laptop over your phone's data connection... so unless your new company arent paying for any data, then it will work regardless.
And apart from excessive data usage, the only way a network could potentially check up on tethering is if you use it for weird and wonderful things and thus use different ports.
no i'm talking about the local machines network. for some reason ics would not work there. so i run a proxy server on the phone. That worked for internet access without using the modem OR ics.
I rarely tether so data usage will probably not be an issue. The thing is on the rare occasion when I do I don't want to have to pay an extra $20/month. That is BS...
I just took a very rare road trip over the weekend and tethered using ICS so we'll see what happened when the bill comes next month.
h0mersimps0n said:
I rarely tether so data usage will probably not be an issue. The thing is on the rare occasion when I do I don't want to have to pay an extra $20/month. That is BS...
I just took a very rare road trip over the weekend and tethered using ICS so we'll see what happened when the bill comes next month.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Please post the result when you get your bill. I am a IT person and once in a while I need to RDP to the office to fix something while I'm on the road. I really don't want to pay $20 more every month for those rare cases.
Blowfish64 said:
Nope. Just need to connect your phone using the Internet Sharing program, and you should be good to go.
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Click to collapse
Was this application removed from the Tilt? I am not seeing it in Programs, Tools, or Settings. Thanks.
madmatt079 said:
Was this application removed from the Tilt? I am not seeing it in Programs, Tools, or Settings. Thanks.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Check your comm manager.
DeniaL said:
Check your comm manager.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
You won't find it under Comm Manager or under Settings... Connections. AT&T has hidden the program (deleted the shortcut), but it's still there, and it works just fine:
Create a shortcut in \windows\start menu\programs (or wherever you want to put it) for the following program:
\windows\IntShrUI.exe
Run it, and you're done.
AT&T settings
H0mersimp0n what are the settings youare using that at&t gave you, I have another post on this forum looking for those. Any help would be great!
Thanks
From a technology standpoint, you will be able to tether with pretty much any AT&T data plan. However, the issue is that doing so is technically a violation of the terms of service. (AT&T goes so far as to single out tethering as being prohibited, unless you are paying for a tethering plan.) In practice, I think most people have found that AT&T tends not to enforce this provision unless your data usage is ridiculously high - at a level that, based on their estimation, is just not consistent with handset use. This is pretty subjective and I think that if anyone got flagged for high usage, it would still be AT&T's burden to "prove" the tethering. (Having said that, while that person might be able to fight against being charged per KB, AT&T might still be able to cancel the contract, anyway)
If you take AT&T's terms of service literally, the vast majority of the data usage on a PDA would be prohibited. From their perspective, only web browsing, checking email and streaming media content that you bought from them would be permitted. Let's see how long AT&T keeps its smartphone/PDA customers if they start enforcing these terms literally.
goestoeleven said:
You won't find it under Comm Manager or under Settings... Connections. AT&T has hidden the program (deleted the shortcut), but it's still there, and it works just fine:
Create a shortcut in \windows\start menu\programs (or wherever you want to put it) for the following program:
\windows\IntShrUI.exe
Run it, and you're done.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
For anyone who needs it, the shortcut should be set to: 41#:MSINTERNET_SHARING?:intshruiapp
And to make it worse, AT&T is jacking with the prices for all internet service through the phone.
Personally I think that internet through Cell networks should be dirt cheap. Why? No "last mile" copper to mess with. The "last mile" is the copper to your house is a pain in the you know what for most provider companies to deal with. It is the highest expense for them. With cell networks, there is no "last mile" and much lower costs for them to keep the network running. Put that with the fact that cellular networks are so much slower than broadband so their connectivity costs are much lower than DSL and Cable. Bottom line is AT&T and others are making a KILLING on network access. The cellular bandwidth is very broad and can handle the data quite easily if more folks were using it real time for access. In the end it probably wouldn't even jump more than 10%, of which they are ready to handle right now.
Let them know you don't appreciate their pricing. It won't get better if we accept things as is.
Personally, I would have liked for this company to have taken off, if it weren't for the feds. http://www.news.com/8301-10784_3-9770197-7.html Damn the man!
New to AT&T
h0mersimps0n said:
The guy at ATT store said last week when I bought my Tilt that in order to use it with my laptop I had to pay the extra ($59/month plan instead of the $39 I was hoping for) for my unlimited data plan.
My question is, if though I have the username and password (cause I called them for it) and am using the HTC ROM (instead of the ATT one), do I still need to be paying extra for the "TETHERING" service?
Thanks guys
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I just got my Tilt and am new to AT&T. I am trying to setup tethering. With my old cellular ISP (Cellular South) I was able to setup my WM5 pda phone as a modem pretty easily.
I am not sure what my username and password is or what do enter to "dial".
With CS ISP the phone and the wireless modem setup just dialed #777.
Can some please point me in a direction?
Thanks!
If you do a hard reset on the tilt and soft reset before the customer configuration takes place, internet sharing icon will appear in the "Programs"
Internet Sharing
Does anyone have any experience with the "Wireless Modem" feature on the new AT&T Tilt?
It appears to offer the same function as Internet Sharing utility but I can't seem to make it work... Anybody know what the heck this Wireless Modem feature is and how to use it with our PDA Unlimited Plan?
I messed with it on my notebook when I was on the road and had no success at all with it...
Sincerely,
Charlie
Just got my Tilt last week, and of course had to upgrade to PDA Personal Max plan (had been using MediaMax successfully with my Wizard). But I figured the increased cost was worth it, and that also I'd be able to access isp.cingular (which I had used before when I was on PDAunlimited plan)
Couldn't access ISP at first, so I called tech support. Very nice lady said "You were on MediaMax, now you've upgraded to PDA Personal Max but they haven't turned ISP on - I will do that for you". She did, it worked, no problem at first. Download speed reported by DSLReports was in 600's, vs. 400-500 when on WAP (on Denver's very recently activated 3G).
Then 2 days ago it quit working. I called - first guy couldn't understand what I wanted, kept trying to step me through configuration in Connections for WAP - I said I've already got that going, with and without proxy, no problem. So he says "Then what's your problem?" I say I'm paying for it, I should be able to access ISP, please be sure it's turned on. He doesn't seem to have a clue as to how to do this, or why I would want to. Call ended in frustration.
Next guy I talked to said "ISP is only for tethered plans". I said, "Oh, really, then what am I paying extra for my plan vs. MediaMax?" and he gives me the song and dance about how MediaMax is for Smartphones and PDA Max is for PDA's. I said I didn't think he knew what he was talking about and hung up.
So, what is the real deal? Shouldn't I be able to access ISP?
Would like to hear other's experiences - especially if successfully using ISP and not on tethered plan.
Hey I went through the same exact issue with AT&T about this isp vs wap. Reading all the talk about how isp was better I had my phone upgraded to it. Everything was working fine until around the time I got 3g service upgraded to my area. I noticed I could not connect anymore so i went back to the old wap settings and everything went through. I do not think it is because of 3g that I can't access isp anymore it's just the timeframe in which it happened. Anyway now when you call AT&T it is almost like they got brainwashed into thinking that isp is only for tethering plans. Even though I tell them I had this configured to my account before it literally seems like that they had that memory wiped out from their recolection. Anyways I guess I am not too upset since 3g was upgraded to the area however having access to isp and ispda would be really great. If anyone is lucky enough to devise a way to get this feature added to their 39.99 plan that would be awesome. However like cushcalc said earlier and like what I have gone through it seems that now isp is now tied to tethered $59.99 plans instead.
Also I wanted to add 1 thing to this. All reps swear that this does nothing to increase your speed however they have now become so resistant to even add this feature now to $39.99. So if it's really the same thing why all the hassle to give people what they want?
It takes time to talk to the RIGHT rep.
Don't worry, i went through the same thing. Until i spoke with a lady and told her that "my wap settings works correctly, but i don't want to connect it using wap.cingular anymore, i want to be able to connect to isp.cingular." She did go on mention about the tethering and blah blah blah. And i told her "im not tethering, i need isp.cingular because it assigns an IP ADDRESS to my phone so i can access my computer remotely when im away from the office from my PPC Phone." In conclusion, she did some research and it seems like there's two different $39.99 pda unlimited plans. So i told her i want the pda unlimited plan that has isp.cingular support and for $39.99. So in conclusion, i guess the rep needs to know the difference of the two. Not sure if this helps, but that's how i got my isp.cingular to for for unlimited us at $39.99 a month.
Ok, i just got my tilt a few days ago, it's my first pda/smart phone, what ever. Whats does all this mean and how do i check which i have. i'm on a 39.99 data plan.
I've tried accessing isp.cingular many times.
Always fails.
After reading this post I decided to give them a call seeing as I have the 39.99 PDA Plan.
Well after getting transferred a couple times, the guy told me my phone was provisioned to access either of the APN's, wap.cingular or isp.cingular.
I think I will keep calling back every day until I get someone that knows wtf they are talking about.
I need to be able to access my work VPN, and have to have a static IP
I've been back and forth with AT&T on this. I'm also in Colorado (but Colorado Springs, not Denver) and we just got 3g as well.
I called about needing isp.cingular to access my home VPN. The first rep told me I had to get the $79.99 tethering plan. I said no thanks. I called again the next day and got a rep who knew actually knew what she was talking about.
She said that feature could be added to my account for $3 a month. I agreed, she made the changes, and I hung up the phone happy. I rebooted the phone (her instructions) and tried to make a connection to isp.cingular. No go. Same error message I always get.
Can someone on this thread verify the connection settings?? This is what I have:
Access Point
ISP.CINGULAR
Username
[email protected]
Password
CINGULAR1
I haven't tried calling back yet, but maybe I will tonight.
PDA Connect can connect to isp.cingular. PDA Personal Max cannot. You need to have them change your plan to PDA Connect and you'll be able to access isp.cingular again.
Someone who can connect to ISP, go into your wireless account screen and get the Plan name. Mine is: PDAPERUNL1500MSG and I can't connect to ISP.
here is the weird part, when I activated my phone and called in for it, the rep told me the PDA plans were EXACTLY the same, same cost, everything else the same, except one included 1500 messages. I made him repeat it and said "So there is NO difference whatsoever except one has 1500 messages included?" He said Yes, so I went with it. But I'm willing to bet, the one w/o 1500 messages allows you to connect to ISP.
Ugghh...
Read my post above yours again. That's exactly what I'm saying. I currently have a tethering plan, but I used to have PDA Connect Unlimited and could use isp.cingular also.
You CANNOT use isp.cingular with the PDA Personal plans.
URPREY said:
You CANNOT use isp.cingular with the PDA Personal plans.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Then why did the AT&T rep tell me I could, but it would cost me an additional $3 a month?? (see attached pic)
Flapjack said:
Then why did the AT&T rep tell me I could, but it would cost me an additional $3 a month?? (see attached pic)
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Did it work? Just because a front-line support person tells you something doesn't make it true.
Flapjack said:
I called about needing isp.cingular to access my home VPN.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I'm on the media max plan and VPN just fine.
I've personally done both IPSEC and PPTP vpn on wap.cingular
DLD
URPREY said:
Did it work? Just because a front-line support person tells you something doesn't make it true.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Obviously, I have to follow-up. The charge is there, for "static IP", which is promising. I will call tomorrow if I have time.
RacerX10 said:
I'm on the media max plan and VPN just fine.
I've personally done both IPSEC and PPTP vpn on wap.cingular
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I can't seem to make it work! I can connect from another network w/o issues, I just can't from my phone. The only place I see to add the VPN connection is under my "Work" network settings....
If someone would enlighten this OLD dog, I would like to see if my TiLt will connect with the isp.cingular.com
Only problem and reply I can use would be to tell me how and where to adjust the settings.
Be kind.....newb at play with my new toy!
Try this
Try and call them and ask them to set you up on this one "PDACnctUntlAdd" that is the exact name i got when i went to the features page on my at&t account online. And it's only for $39.99 and my isp.cingular works perfectly with 3g connections.
Out of curiosity I tried changing my Tilts MEdia Net settings to go to isp rather then wap, and couldn't make a connection.
Portland Oregon Area, with the 39.99 PDA Personal w/ 1500txt
I get 500-900 on the 3G out here, 80-150ish on EDGE, and around 1.6mbps on my wifi connection through my cable internet. No complaints!
Would like to know what kind of a change this would make though, other then the IP assignment.
Bubbacs
In your Settings / Connections / Connections screen, click "manage existing" and then edit Media Net. First screen is to change name, 2nd screen is to assign wap or isp.
I may be reitterating some information here, but I can tell you as a fact, APN isp.cingular is being reserved for either PDA Connect Unlimited, or a Data Connect plan. If you are any of the PDA Personal plans, access to isp.cingular WILL BE TURNED OFF. There are however, a VERY small number of users that (by shear luck) didn't have isp.cingular turned off when they changed from PDA Connect Unlimited to PDA Personal Max.
My advise is.. if you can't get isp.cingular to work, quit beating your head over it and change your plan to PDA Connect, or get a laptop card plan like I did.
I did a long research thread on this at the at&t forums. I cannot access that site anymore, but maybe someone else could dig up a link.
GWelker62 said:
I may be reitterating some information here, but I can tell you as a fact, APN isp.cingular is being reserved for either PDA Connect Unlimited, or a Data Connect plan. If you are any of the PDA Personal plans, access to isp.cingular WILL BE TURNED OFF. There are however, a VERY small number of users that (by shear luck) didn't have isp.cingular turned off when they changed from PDA Connect Unlimited to PDA Personal Max.
My advise is.. if you can't get isp.cingular to work, quit beating your head over it and change your plan to PDA Connect, or get a laptop card plan like I did.
I did a long research thread on this at the at&t forums. I cannot access that site anymore, but maybe someone else could dig up a link.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Is this the correct one G? http://forums.wireless.att.com/cng/board/message?board.id=cingular&message.id=49092#M49092
OK, isp.cingular and a real ISP has been discussed quite a bit in the past, especially after the new rom came out and the PDA Personal Max data plan. And this is when the trouble started. Many users lost the ability to use a real ISP and some didn't. Some of the fixes posted worked for some and others it didn't.
For me none of the fixes worked but using APN wap.cingular really did what I needed, so I decided to leave it alone. After I decided to upgrade my data plan to Data Connect, I now NEED to use isp.cingular. I cannot log in my company's VPN unless I use APN isp.cingular. So I was bound and determined to make it work. After much reconnaissance I found all the answers right here on the at&t forums. But there are many pieces to the puzzle and they were spread out all over the place. This is going to be an attempt to put the pieces all in one place so the picture will come together.
Update 05/06/07 1:40pm
I put this information together with the assumption of readers having some working knowledge of Windows Mobile 5 and mobile phone usage. If you are a complete NOOB to the whole WM5 thing this information will create more questions than answers. I am far from being a tech guru and if I can half learn this stuff with both my brain cells, then most other people can too. But still..... noobs enter at your own risk.
The Connection Profiles
Now, the new rom sets up the two network connections, "My ISP" and "Media Net". Refer to here Browser/internet Settings There is a link in that page also for configure and use the My ISP profile. For the MEdia Net connections follow the instructions to the letter. Now the My ISP instructions differ from what the new rom sets up automatically. (and if you call CS the data guys will walk you through those settings in that link) The new rom will have the settings for a "real ISP" connection. You will notice, if you follow those instructions it has you change a couple of things. For one it has you change the APN isp.cingular to wap.cingular. Well this won't give you a "real ISP" connection but it will make the My ISP profile work for web browsing. I did a survey of users on who had "My ISP" working and the ones that answered yes, I bet they were still using wap.cingular in the MY ISP profile. So they were/are not getting a real ISP connection. I will quote from that settings page and maybe it will give you clue on it's purpose for using wap.cingular in the My ISP connection profile:
# Additional features such as Wi-f and device based e-mail along with other 3rd party applications may not be compatible with the proxy settings associated with the MEdia Net profile.
# If there are connection issues with e-mail and/or Wi-Fi, configuring and using the My ISP profile as displayed below may resolve connectivity issues.
# Configuring the AT&T 8525 to use My ISP will disable MEdia Net (WAP) web pages when My ISP is used for connectivity. However, regular Internet (HTML) web page browsing will function as normal.
Now the best I can figure, all this does is give two profiles and both use APN wap.cingular, but one uses a proxy server and one doesn't. Which brings me to my next category.
The Proxy Manager cabs
There are two cab files in a folder called Proxy Manager, under your programs menu. These two cab files enable and disable the proxy settings via a registry edit. Now, to me, if I continue to use the MEdia Net connection for all internet use, and utilize these cab files to disable and enable the proxy, I am doing the same thing as above by setting up those two network connections and swapping back and forth from them. Now once you have the My ISP connection profile set up with "real isp" settings it will be no longer necessary to use these cab files. All you have to do is switch back and forth from MEdia Net and My ISP. The MEdia Net profile has the proxy settings built in and you will have to use it if you want access to the Media Net home page.
http://home or http://device.home
Now on to the next topic....
How Do I Get A "Real ISP" To Work?
After it is all said and done, the bottom line is you have to be on the right data plan. From what I have learn't, you have be on a PDA Connect Unlimited, or a Data Connect Unlimited before your account is provisioned to access through isp.cingular. There are a lucky few that when they switched to PDA Personal Max, isp.cingular was not turned off (lucky dogs who's names we shall not speak ). But if it is turned off, CS will NOT turn it back on untill you get on the right data plan and that is the FIRST step. PERIOD Once you do have the right data plan and isp.cingular is "turned on" then it is as simple as setting up My ISP with the "real isp" settings. And thats it! For a recap of those settings refer to RonAnnArbor's post here. You can consider this post a supplement to Ron's.
Something About PIE
Now lets assume you got on the right data plan and isp.cingular is provisioned, and the My ISP profile is set up to use the "real isp" settings but it DOESN'T WORK! You pull up PIE to view a web page and it times out and displays one of those dreaded error messages. Have no fear I found the answer on the at&t forums too. But credit for it should go to the folks over at the XDA site. (man there are some pretty tech savvy folks over there! I wish I was as knowledgeable as those guys) There are some settings in the registry for PIE to auto detect proxy settings. Let's keep it simple and say PIE is "hard coded" in the new rom to always use wap.cingular. So if your connected to isp.cingular, well... you get the picture. That may not be technically accurate, but I think it will be easy for most to understand. (at least for my two brain cells it is ) You will find that everything else that needs access to the internet will work, like email, weather programs, but one will assume they have no internet access if PIE doesn't work. Now lets fix that too, but it will take a registry edit to do it. If you don't know how to do registry editing, I suggest you get a reg editor like Resco or Total Commander and learn how to use it. Now here is what you do. Go to:
HKCU \ Software \ Microsoft \ Windows \ CurrentVersion \ Internet Settings
There will be a Dword labeled "EnableAutoDetect". The default value that detects the proxy is "0", you can change it to a "1" but I recommend deleting the entire entry. Also after a reset go back and make sure it is gone. Sometimes the changes don't stick and you will have to do it again. Another thing to remember is DON'T use the Proxy Manager cabs again. The enable proxy cab will re-write those settings back in there.
Update 8/5/07 8:25pm: I have experienced an anomaly of the "EnableAutoDetect" Dword showing back up in the registry after a soft reset. No proxy cabs were used to cause it. At this time I have not figured out the "why" because it happened only twice. I will edit this update if I find the cause/fix. For right now I thought users should be aware of it and delete it again if necessary.
The Technical Side of APN (Or, what's the difference between isp.cingular and wap.cingular?)
Instead of me spouting off a lot of Geek language and acronyms I don't really know, I am going to link to this page. I have posted this link before and the entire page is some really good infomation. For the information related to the title of this paragraph, scroll down to the section labeled "There are two Cingular access points".
Multimedia Messages
If you want ot send/recieve MMSs, this "real isp" connection is not going to work. For over all web browsing, email, weather updates, ect, the MEdia Net profile should work just fine. I leave mine on MEdia Net most of the time. It is only when I am going to tether, or if a web site is acting flaking (that's a techincal term you know) I will switch over to My ISP. If you are connecting through My ISP when a MMS comes in, it will be a text message directing you to www.viewmymessages.com. (As of this writing this is how it seems to work)
Yep, that should be it. Of course all I can see is my ticket to Banville, but from your copy and paste, that should be the one.
FYI, some of the links from the copy/paste are not functional. But you should see them on the OP on the at&t forum.
The full thread can be found here.
Hi!
In german boards there are several speculations about how the N1's WiFi tethering works and how carriers might detect it. But there are no real facts, it seems like there is no one, who really knows about it.
Maybe here are some kind of "cracks", who really know what they are talking about and can provide some real information about it.
How does N1-tethering work? I guess it uses NAT-routing. Is this right? And the probably most important part: How do carriers detect tethering? They officially claim, they could detect it. But the question is, which way do they do this? Can they only detect if you use tethering at all, or do they also have the ability to separate between tethered data and phone's data? Only in that case they would be capable to bill the tethered data (here in Germany some carriers do not prohibit tethering, they can only charge about 50 cent per MB).
Is it possible, that the carrier only detect several devices, that connect to the internet using tethering? I'm a vodafone-customer and I've tried tethering my iPad and my Linux-Netbook several times. Nothing has been charged. Other customers, having the same data-plan, reported, that they habe been charged for tethering within minutes.
Maybe someone can answer my questions.
I dont know how it works but "I would imagine the request headers are what the provider is reading in order to determine the device/browser that is making the request."
http://talk.maemo.org/archive/index.php/t-3757.html
If it really is like that, then I would just have to use Cisco-VPN on my iPad and they would not be able to read any requests anymore.
But someone in the official German vodafone-board said, the user-agent doesn't matter. And he seemed to be very sure about that. But unfortunately he didn't tell anything else. If you think of Dolphin for Android, which allows you to change the browser-identification, it really looks like this is nothing the carrier could make use of.
cymru said:
I dont know how it works but "I would imagine the request headers are what the provider is reading in order to determine the device/browser that is making the request."
http://talk.maemo.org/archive/index.php/t-3757.html
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I don't believe this to be accurate as phones are capable of changing their user agent to mimic a desktop browser, so it wouldn't be a reliable way of identifying a tethered connection.
IMO, there is no 100% fool proof way as it sits. The carrier can look at the traffic patterns though and might be able to figure it out though. Remember when you're connected to your carrier everything you do is going through their gateway, so they can see everything you're doing.
I agree that if you're wanting to make 100% sure they don't know, a VPN tunneling traffic would work. Once the traffic is encrypted, they have no way to tell what is happening, aside from the actual amount of data being transferred, which is why a lot of carriers in the USA or switching away from unlimited data plans and offering only limited ones (i.e. a 2gb or 5gb limit on plans).
It was discussed here a couple of months ago, I remember..
The discussion ended in - if the phone specifically didn't send the carrier any sign that it's tethering, detection of tethering would require heuristic scan patterns on the data that's being transferred - and would violate some "internet openness" rules in the process, and possibly allow a legal case against the carrier.
So, do you by any chance have custom ROM and your friends have official carrier ROMs? That might explain the difference.
People in spain have reported being charged more by vodafone (they charge you more if you tether and your plan doesnt cover it) by simply using an app on the phone that changed the browser's user agent to mimic a desktop one.
I dont know whether it is or it isnt legal to read the 'headers' of HTTP messages. It's more to do with the protocol than with the content, and both ends need to be able to read these things to actually work, some routers may even scoop just to adjust to different QoS patterns or whatever. So it might be legal after all.
Port activity can tell you're tethering or not; moreover, tethering does likely bypass proxy server which is used for phone only.
Ok, to find out more I've made a little research about how to generally detect Network Address Translation and I've made some tests.
As it seems, the Browser-Identification won't work. Maybe in spain there are some data-plans which only allow browsing with the special phone's browser and only using HTTP-Connections. But that's not suitable for a real data plan, which allows you, to send every data you like from your phone. On the other hand, at least in Germany, I think they wouldn't be allowed to read the data content of TCP-packets.
Then I've used a packet sniffer to find out, how different devices (N1, iPad and Kubuntu10.04) handle things like outgoing ports and packet IDs.
Both won't be very likely to use by the carrier, because Android doesn't increment them, but uses it by shuffle. The iPad also shuffles the packet IDs, but increments the ports. I think this will not matter, because the NAT will redirect the ports anyway. Only Kubuntu increments packet IDs and as they normally aren't changed by NAT, carriers could detect that. In general, all of the devices used outgoing ports between 35,000 and 55,000.
Possibly they could look at the time to live of the packets. The interesting question is, how the N1's NAT handels the TTL. Normally, a router decrements the TTL by 1. But it doesn't have to.
All of my tested devices use a TTL of 64 for outgoing packets (no one will wonder about that, because all those system are based on UNIX or Linux). So, if the NAT decrements the TTL, the carrier could detect tethered packets quite easily. Normal packets would reach the carrier's gateway with TTL 64, tethered packets with TTL 63. Maybe, the NAT doesn't decrement the TTL. Then the carrier wouldn't be able to detect it this way, except of this: As I read, Windows-Systems use a TTL of 128, so the carrier ould detect this immediately, no matter if it's decremented or not. This would explain why some people tell they could tether other phones without being billed, but getting charged when tethering their PC. This could only be covered, if the NAT would rewrite the TTL with 64. It don't think it does.
Maybe someone, who has a rooted phone (mine is not rooted, it's a normal FRF91), could install packet sniffer from the market and then catch some packets while tethering. Then we could have a look at the packet's headers and maybe find out, what the NAT does with the TTL.
FYI this isn't technically a problem in the US - it's illegal for carriers to monitor the actual data streams without a warrant.
My understanding is that tethering (WiFi/USB) can be accomplished in two different fashions.
1) The phone (in this case the Nexus One) acts as the modem and router and re-requests whatever the tethered device requested. Thus, the mobile operator sees the Nexus One as using the DATA rather than the actual device requesting the DATA.
2) The phone simply passes the requests to mobile operator along with some identifying info about the requesting device. (the preferred method by the mobile operators)
I have no idea which method the Nexus One (FroYo) employs, but I have a suspicion that it is method 1.
Dan
i Will say it does work as a wifi hotspot, so i connected using my ipad up to the ssid the nexus made, and connected fine, but un sure if charges will appear, i will keep a eye out on my next bill.. but they dont detect then that saves me $25/mon for the 3g data, if i can just use my phone $30 unlimited..
I was wondering about this as well. I have the current $25/mo 2gb plan and I sometimes need to use my laptop to check things that I need a larger screen for (Mostly graphic design attachments like illustrator and photoshop files). Would AT&T detect my using the Nexus One as a hotspot, and if so, would they charge?
I think the whole tethering thing is kind of ridiculous on AT&T. You're paying an extra $20+ per month to use the data you're already paying for except on your computer. They've been dealing with Apple for far too long...
In UK 3 know I'm tethering...
On using my Laptop tethered I get a 3 splash screen on first opening up a browser (IE or Firefox). There don't seem to be any other issues (everything else then works fine & dandy) ... yet...
Can't be that long before some carrier decides to clamp down on tethering some more...
Lodger
theartfullodger said:
In UK 3 know I'm tethering...
On using my Laptop tethered I get a 3 splash screen on first opening up a browser (IE or Firefox). There don't seem to be any other issues (everything else then works fine & dandy) ... yet...
Can't be that long before some carrier decides to clamp down on tethering some more...
Lodger
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Nexus bought from their network? Rooted? What ROM?
The only viable (and probably legal) way for an operator to detech tethering is via looking data consumptions, other methods discussed over here although technically possible, would be administratively expensive even if legally allowed... I suggest if you are on an unlimited data plan and want to be heavy on tethering do it from the start not later on in order not to raise any flags on the operator side.
Cheers, sub
Sent from my Nexus One using XDA App
unknownrebelx said:
I was wondering about this as well. I have the current $25/mo 2gb plan and I sometimes need to use my laptop to check things that I need a larger screen for (Mostly graphic design attachments like illustrator and photoshop files). Would AT&T detect my using the Nexus One as a hotspot, and if so, would they charge?
I think the whole tethering thing is kind of ridiculous on AT&T. You're paying an extra $20+ per month to use the data you're already paying for except on your computer. They've been dealing with Apple for far too long...
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I've been using my N1 on AT&T to tether a pretty good amount and had no complaints. I even stream netflix movies and haven't heard a word.
obviously our phones send and receive data over wifi. when tethering, the phone is still sending and receiving data over wifi, it's just connecting to another device. not to be rude but it is a pretty easy concept. it is an amazing thing though.
right now i am on a camping trip, and i of course brought my phone and laptop with me so i have been tethering a bit. i just happened to be in an area with fantastic signal strength and speedtest.net shows that i am getting up to 2.5Mbps down, and about 1Mbps or so up. it's working GREAT! it's still not cable or fios fast, but it's fast.
Tethering on Talkmobile
I've recently get an unlimited data Talkmobile contract (UK) and I'm thinking of tethering (it's against T&Cs). Has anyone else done this? If they don't detect it, it's a great deal at only £12 month (though the unlimited deal which I have got is no longer available).
I was thinking, the mentioned methods of detecting tethering, even if they are viable and legal, might not be enough for the operators to prove that I was tethering, and hence they couldn't legally do anything about it. I don't know if this is the case or not (but I think I'll choose to believe that).
If I can tether, it means I can buy the PS Vita WiFi only and have as much connectivity as the 3G version!
Sounds like a good project for this weekend. I'll do some packet sniffing and post if I find anything. TMO in US, though.
would the carrier (Three in the uk) be able to detect tethering if i connected my phone to a vpn. because then surely all data would look identical?
HTC Desire, cm7.1
Hi everyone, recently I been seeing from other threads and sections other than Nexus 5 about members having a hard time tethering their data to computers, video game consoles, tablets, etc. I have been tethering my phone to my PS3 ever since we were able to use 4G internet on Nexus 4's and T-Mobile stepping their game up.
I have been researching and trying out various apps to use my tethering to its full extent(mind you, I have the truly unlimited plan ever since it came out, with 500mb sharing data). Likewise, whether you abuse this glorious internet that T-Mobile has to offer, or have no other ISP other than T-Mobile, I'll share you my settings for making the tethering work.
Update: as of March(ish)/April(ish), I've noticed that tethering is a PAIN in the butt. However, I was able to still get tethering to work, and I hope this all applies to you all (not just the truly unlimited plans, but also prepaid and limited GB plans). There is but one problem I have experienced, and I'm not SURE if it's T-Mobile getting REALLY smart or my phone is in the brink of failing me, but I get disconnected 15 minutes later after connecting my phone to PS3 to play online (BO2). Back then, I would never have this problem. What's worse is my data would actually stall and not connect yet I'm still seeing full signal. Only fix is turning on airplane mode and off. Anyways, enough with the blabbering.
Note:I know some of these steps is not really necessary for me since I have truly unlimited, but I like to take pre cautions. YOU MUST HAVE ROOT
First: Download SQ Lite Editor on your phone (if you have one for your computer, by means go ahead). Locate the settings.db by going to data/data/com.android.providers.settings/databases/settings.db. Once you find it, go to global and insert a new entry "tether_dun_required" with the value "0". Once done, save and close. If you're using a computer, well, you should also know how that works.
Second: Download build prop editor on the Play Store. Add a new entry by pressing the pencil icon on the bottom that says "net.tethering.noprovisioning=true". Reboot phone.
Third: Head over to your APN and DELETE EVERYTHING. Add a new APN named T-Mobile GPRS(you can name it whatever you want), with the APN:"fast.t-mobile.com". MMSC:http://mms.msg.eng.t-mobile.com/mms/wapenc
MMS Port:80
MMC:310
MNC:260
APN Type:default,MMS,dun
APN Protocol and Roaming Protocol both IPV4.
Save.
Now here's the app's I use.
Clockworkmod Tether: For computers. Since I have a desktop, this is the best USB tether connection IMO. Download the app on the store and download the drivers on your PC/Laptop and voila, insta connect. Now in terms of user agent switcher, I would download fiddle2 on your computer. This program monitors all IP's going thru. Open up fiddler, go to "Rules," "User-Agents," and select "Custom..." A window will pop up. Leave this blank and click okay. Now, all of the network traffic from that computer with have its user-agent string modified to "User-Agent:[blank]" Test this out on any browser on your computer and you should not be redirected to the upsell page.http://forum.xda-developers.com/showthread.php?t=2493675 if you need more information. But on all honesty, just find a user agent switch on Chrome extensions and choose IE7. I been using that for years with no problem.
WiFi Tether Router: By far my favorite tethering app (shout out to the creator Fabio) for playing my ps3. I have tried this on my friends ps4 and it works. I also used this app to share my data to other peoples cellphones and laptops. If you don't have $2.50 to spare then idk what to say....anyways here's the setup.
WiFi Name:whatever you want.
Password: whatever
Channel:0
Interface: wlan0
Method: auto
Enable DMZ(for gaming)
On DCHP Setting: click "get default provider DNS" and then check mark DNS redirect and save config.
On advance WiFi setting please make sure to disable scanning always available. Now fire it up and see if all goes well. If you want source of where I got this setting, head on over to https://sites.google.com/site/wifitetherrouter/home/device-configuration
I hope these settings will help you guys. I hope someone else had the same problem with me randomly disconnecting and hopefully found a fix. As for T-Mobile, they have gotten smart about tethering. Hopefully they won't become another Verizon or AT&T. But in reality, please, if you're gonna download big files or movies, use your home internet. If you have truly unlimited, then use your phone to download them. Why do you have to tether to a computer to download torrents and whatever when your phone can do that? It's called smartphone for a reason. Wanna stream a movie? Get slimport or a Chromecast and hook it on the TV. Use the hotspot for small things and personal things such as home works, projects, research, etc.
Let me know if you have any other questions.
Don't be an A-Hole... There is a reason why no carrier provides Unmetered/Unlimited tethering.
Data usage from a computer is almost 5X more than a smart phone, as on a full PC everything isn't compressed while on on a smartphone data usage is much smaller.
Doing this will only further increase congestion from all data hogs like you.
See: http://www.tmonews.com/2014/08/clea...ing-data-misuse-is-not-widespread-throttling/
"A very small number of our customers are misusing their Simple Choice Unlimited data service in violation of their rate plan and terms and conditions by bypassing the default tethering feature or engaging in peer-to-peer (P2P) file-sharing. This type of usage can negatively impact our ability to offer affordable unlimited data. In order to protect all T-Mobile customers, we will be reaching out to these people to educate them on our terms and conditions of service, but if the misuse continues, they could have their data speeds reduced for the remainder of their billing cycle."
Tether_dun_required 0 and I can tether all day on system tether app.
markdapimp said:
Don't be an A-Hole... There is a reason why no carrier provides Unmetered/Unlimited tethering.
Data usage from a computer is almost 5X more than a smart phone, as on a full PC everything isn't compressed while on on a smartphone data usage is much smaller.
Doing this will only further increase congestion from all data hogs like you.
See: http://www.tmonews.com/2014/08/clea...ing-data-misuse-is-not-widespread-throttling/
"A very small number of our customers are misusing their Simple Choice Unlimited data service in violation of their rate plan and terms and conditions by bypassing the default tethering feature or engaging in peer-to-peer (P2P) file-sharing. This type of usage can negatively impact our ability to offer affordable unlimited data. In order to protect all T-Mobile customers, we will be reaching out to these people to educate them on our terms and conditions of service, but if the misuse continues, they could have their data speeds reduced for the remainder of their billing cycle."
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I'm not being an A hole, I'm just trying to tell people to use the tethering smartly. I have been tethering since T-Mobile only had 500mb of sharing. Not once have I went over the sharing data. I BARELY use my computer to surf the internet. Why would I need to use a computer to surf the internet when modern smart phones are capable of handling websites and flash. I even said I use slimport to see everything in a bigger view.
m52 power! said:
Tether_dun_required 0 and I can tether all day on system tether app.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Yea this is all I needed too do. Some guy made a zip to do it automatically, I updated it to work with lollipop.
http://forum.xda-developers.com/goo...-tether-dun-required-0-flashable-zip-t2942756
Sent from my Nexus 5 using XDA Free mobile app
T-Mobile Tethering
Not to be redundant here, But if your paying for the "unlimited data plan"
it includes Tethering! not sure what the data limit is but it's included in the cost.
While phones before the nexus 5 had to be hacked to change the setting so you could tether [on t-mobile AFAIK], they still can tell your on a pc.
Obviously there are ways around the limits, BTDT but theres no need on unlimited plan.
My unlimited plan doesn't have tethering. It's true unlimited with no cap or throttling on T-Mobile. My Galaxy Nexus didn't need any "hacks" to tether.
Sent from my Nexus 5 using Tapatalk
My unlimited states it comes with 5gb of tethering
This is a pretty simple question but I can't seem to find the answer anywhere on the internet. I'm sure any Project Fi user can answer easily...
So I understand how Project Fi works with the free WiFi hotspots that they have verified as “fast and reliable.” It connects to them seamlessly and secures it with a VPN. My question is about what happens with other open WiFi networks that are not on Google's magic list. Obviously you would have to connect manually since it's not a "verified" network, but once you are connected does Google still route your traffic through a VPN? Or are you on your own? I'm always weary about connecting to open WiFi networks when I'm traveling, but I'm too lazy/cheap to set up proper SSH Tunneling or a VPN. It would be great if Google left the VPN functionality there when you manually connect to an unsecured network. I doubt it, but figured I'd ask.
While I'm at it, I was also curious about the prevalence of these "verified" WiFi hotspots. Google's Project Fi coverage map shows you the 4G/3G/2G coverage and that is all well and good. But it seems that the important thing from a money-saving standpoint is how often is it going to be able keep you on WiFi vs cellular data. It would be great if they had a separate map (or a layer you could turn on in the existing map) to get a feel for how often you can expect to be on WiFi. Anyone have a good feel for how prevalent these things are really? This is especially important because I'm coming from Verizon where 4G LTE coverage is better than the combined Google Fi coverage. The Google Fi 4G LTE coverage is maybe a quarter of the Verizon 4G LTE coverage.
Thanks in advance.
My understanding is if you don't get the key icon in the status bar, you are not on Google's VPN. It would be up to you to use something like TunnelBear or OpenVPN's Private Tunnel. I agree it would be great for them to make their VPN available or at least natively support TAP in Android
This is from a moderator at the official Google+ Project Fi Community:
Currently, the Google VPN is only supported for those where WiFi Assistant is used. This means that the VPN will only kick in when your device automatically connects to WiFi networks that Google has verified as reliable and secure. When the VPN is kicked in, you'll notice a little secure key icon next to the WiFi status indicator.
To answer your second question, there is currently no list or coverage map of the verified WiFi hotspots, but it has been requested. Be sure to also add your voice by sending feedback via the Fi app.
I hope this information answers your questions! I'm here if you have any more.
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crachel said:
My understanding is if you don't get the key icon in the status bar, you are not on Google's VPN. It would be up to you to use something like TunnelBear or OpenVPN's Private Tunnel. I agree it would be great for them to make their VPN available or at least natively support TAP in Android
This is from a moderator at the official Google+ Project Fi Community:
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Yea that's pretty much what I figured. If it used VPN everywhere it MIGHT be worth it for me to drop my Verizon unlimited because the VPN service would pay for itself. Or if they had a coverage map of these verified Wi-Fi networks so I could at least know what I'm getting into. Seems like a little too much of an unknown for me to jump ship right now knowing I can't ever get back.
Thanks for the information.
sorry, old thread, but i figured it'd be better than creating a new one...
i finally got signed up for fi on my 6p. (op, in case you're still wondering i haven't encountered any of those open hotspots in my hometown yet) My question is, can i somehow force the vpn to enable, even on networks i have to sign in to? (thinking of home, campus wifi, etc)