Database Develop

General S21 Ultra LTPO Discussion

All,
I was pretty curious to try the new screen tech since the launch event, today i got the device, enabled frame rate monitor on developer settings to see the LTPO in action, contrary to what they said on launch event the screen switches back and forth only between 60 and 120hz , 120hz during scrolling , 60hz when the screen is static without any input. It doesn't go all the way as low as 11hz
Wondering is this the right way of implementation , members please share your findings or information related to LTPO here to discuss upon

bala_gamer said:
All,
I was pretty curious to try the new screen tech since the launch event, today i got the device, enabled frame rate monitor on developer settings to see the LTPO in action, contrary to what they said on launch event the screen switches back and forth only between 60 and 120hz , 120hz during scrolling , 60hz when the screen is static without any input. It doesn't go all the way as low as 11hz
Wondering is this the right way of implementation , members please share your findings or information related to LTPO here to discuss upon
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Give this a read - can't remember exactly what was said, maybe a limitation of the developer settings and not the phone
Samsung's Note20 Ultra Variable Refresh Rate Display Explained
www.anandtech.com

mtm1401 said:
Give this a read - can't remember exactly what was said, maybe a limitation of the developer settings and not the phone
Samsung's Note20 Ultra Variable Refresh Rate Display Explained
www.anandtech.com
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
read them as soon as andrei published it, would love to see his deep dive into the new panel in s21 and see what benefits it brings to the equation

bala_gamer said:
read them as soon as andrei published it, would love to see his deep dive into the new panel in s21 and see what benefits it brings to the equation
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Ah fair enough, he's comparisons of the two models are always worth reading! I did find the bit I was referring to if that helps. Basically the OS can't recognise the lower refresh rate but they are there.
'One problem (from our perspective) with this LFD mechanism is that it is seemingly completely transparent to user-space, so there’s no good way to verify that it’s active or working - the OS simply states that you’re either in the 120Hz or 60Hz VRR modes, however with LFD on top the actual refresh rate can be different. One way to verify this externally is simply to measure the end-result that the new panel technology is meant to bring to the user: lower power consumption. It’s also here that we encounter some of the quirks in Samsung’s implementation.'

Will be interesting to see if the adaptive rate works in lower light unlike the note!

mtm1401 said:
Ah fair enough, he's comparisons of the two models are always worth reading! I did find the bit I was referring to if that helps. Basically the OS can't recognise the lower refresh rate but they are there.
'One problem (from our perspective) with this LFD mechanism is that it is seemingly completely transparent to user-space, so there’s no good way to verify that it’s active or working - the OS simply states that you’re either in the 120Hz or 60Hz VRR modes, however with LFD on top the actual refresh rate can be different. One way to verify this externally is simply to measure the end-result that the new panel technology is meant to bring to the user: lower power consumption. It’s also here that we encounter some of the quirks in Samsung’s implementation.'
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
That's the crux, whether it works or not we are limited to either 60 or 120hz on os level. Hope there is a way where this can be monitored more precisely via some workaround

This app seems to report (and limit) refresh rates other than 60 and 120hz, but I don't know how if it's not exposed by the OS.
[App]Galaxy Max Hz (Refresh Rate Mods, Screen-off Mods, QS Tiles, Tasker Support and More)
About this app: Refresh Rate Mods Change default refresh rates - Easily change the overall refresh rate settings of devices supporting multiple refresh rates. - Set supported mid refresh rates as the maximum refresh rate limit for battery...
forum.xda-developers.com

dscline said:
This app seems to report (and limit) refresh rates other than 60 and 120hz, but I don't know how if it's not exposed by the OS.
[App]Galaxy Max Hz (Refresh Rate Mods, Screen-off Mods, QS Tiles, Tasker Support and More)
About this app: Refresh Rate Mods Change default refresh rates - Easily change the overall refresh rate settings of devices supporting multiple refresh rates. - Set supported mid refresh rates as the maximum refresh rate limit for battery...
forum.xda-developers.com
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Those refresh rates (e.g. 48hz and 96hz on Note 20 ultra) are actually exposed on OS level. If my understanding is right on the way that current android system works, S21 ultra implementation is probably the same to note 20 ultra with the addition of10hz as the lowest in the predefined set of refresh rates.

Question Xiaomi Mi 11 Global ROM not consistent 120hz.

I ordered a Xiaomi Mi 11 Global edition.
It is MIUI 12.0.3.0 Global out of the box.
I noticed that the 120hz is not consistent and stable. I am not sure if this is because MIUI lacks optimization or the apps I am using is not yet optimized for 120hz.
For example, when I browse a photo to be uploaded in facebook, the entire display shifts back to 60hz. Or when I scroll down a long post/thread in Reddit, Facebook, Twitter and other social media, the display scales back down to 60hz. I believe this is not a hardware issue, since the Snapdragon888 is more than capable of running this task.
Multi-tasking and opening the recent menu shifts the display to 90hz.
When playing games that only support 60hz, the frame rate begins to stutter, so I have to turn the refresh rate to 60hz.
I have to restart the phone to turn back to 120hz to fix these issues. Is this caused by adaptive refresh rate?
I also tried turning the display down to 1080p, still no luck.
I am considering flashing the EU ROM, hoping things would be fine. It is unfortunate that I could not fully enjoy the 1440p + 120hz display of the Mi 11.
Xiaomi should not spam phones into the market every month, so their software developers could focus more on optimization, since there would be less devices.

Settings / Display / Display resolution / when you use WQHD+ underneath uncheck / Save battery with WQHD

here you can see( left upper corner) how is work the refresh rate on this phone

RebornCheiko said:
I ordered a Xiaomi Mi 11 Global edition.
It is MIUI 12.0.3.0 Global out of the box.
I noticed that the 120hz is not consistent and stable. I am not sure if this is because MIUI lacks optimization or the apps I am using is not yet optimized for 120hz.
For example, when I browse a photo to be uploaded in facebook, the entire display shifts back to 60hz. Or when I scroll down a long post/thread in Reddit, Facebook, Twitter and other social media, the display scales back down to 60hz. I believe this is not a hardware issue, since the Snapdragon888 is more than capable of running this task.
Multi-tasking and opening the recent menu shifts the display to 90hz.
When playing games that only support 60hz, the frame rate begins to stutter, so I have to turn the refresh rate to 60hz.
I have to restart the phone to turn back to 120hz to fix these issues. Is this caused by adaptive refresh rate?
I also tried turning the display down to 1080p, still no luck.
I am considering flashing the EU ROM, hoping things would be fine. It is unfortunate that I could not fully enjoy the 1440p + 120hz display of the Mi 11.
Xiaomi should not spam phones into the market every month, so their software developers could focus more on optimization, since there would be less devices.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
You can force 120hz all the time by setting the minimum refresh rate to 120hz, using the following commands in ADB :
- adb shell
- settings put system min_refresh_rate 120

ralovesoc said:
You can force 120hz all the time by setting the minimum refresh rate to 120hz, using the following commands in ADB :
- adb shell
- settings put system min_refresh_rate 120
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I'm a complete noob can I get a walkthrough and what is ADB?

How To Guide Changing your Refreshrate to 90hz.

If you want to change your Refreshrate to 90hz follow this quick guide.
Tested on the latest miui version.
First of all go to the Playstore and download following app:
SetEdit SettingsDatabaseEditor - Apps on Google Play
Provides direct access to the Android settings database
play.google.com
Afterwards go to your settings and change your Refreshrate to 120.
Open the app and find the entry "user_refresh_rate" "120".
Click on the entry, choose to edit and change the number to 90.
Repeat this step with the peak entry and change it to 90hz too.
Close the app.
Voila: you running on 90hz now. In my opinion that's the sweetspot between snappiness and battery saving.
Props to jmikepr:
Unable to make this work. Tried it about a hundred times. Running. EU ROM 12.6
Edit: Got it to work by changing peak display setting and user display setting. Thanks for the tip. 120 hz is overkill. 90hz is perfect.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
UPDATE PLEASE READ:
UPDATE FOR EVERYONE!
Changing your refreshrate to 90hz will make some crazy things to your display!
It will get a greenish tint !
Grey will also be displayed really red/brownish
It will flicker even on max brightness!
It will burn in faster - at least my new mi11 u has already some burn ins compared to my mi11 from CN which is like 3 months old now I don't know for sure tho! It's so minimal only my hawk eye can see it anybody else couldn't till now.
Sorry but I just found this out now because my colours looked to differently with low brightness. I also got an exchange device and thought it was just a bad display.

Unable to make this work. Tried it about a hundred times. Running. EU ROM 12.6
Edit: Got it to work by changing peak display setting and user display setting. Thanks for the tip. 120 hz is overkill. 90hz is perfect.

jmikepr said:
Unable to make this work. Tried it about a hundred times. Running. EU ROM 12.6
Edit: Got it to work by changing peak display setting and user display setting. Thanks for the tip. 120 hz is overkill. 90hz is perfect.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Oh good to know! I will at this in the original post.

Anyway to dynamically adjust it based on what's on screen and whether it's moving or not?

speedtripler said:
Anyway to dynamically adjust it based on what's on screen and whether it's moving or not?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Not right now. Maybe I can find a way - I will let you know.

hotto1996 said:
Not right now. Maybe I can find a way - I will let you know.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I read about a way, I think it was from another manufacturer , and it could lower the refresh rate down to 1hz when looking at a still image etc or a page of text etc , something that doesn't need to be constantly refreshed which would obviously be a major battery saver
If I can find the article again I'll post the link

To my surprise, my eyes can't even accept 90hz now. Talk about spoiled.
Great method regardless, thanks for sharing!

linnil said:
To my surprise, my eyes can't even accept 90hz now. Talk about spoiled.
Great method regardless, thanks for sharing!
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Really haha? I change the animation speeds too via developer settings. For me that's smooth enough!

hotto1996 said:
Really haha? I change the animation speeds too via developer settings. For me that's smooth enough!
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I'm impatient af
I disable all animations in dev options.
I just want to click something and boom, it's on the screen!

Yeah I think so too. I don't understand why everything needs to look fancy. I want a fast and snappy experience

Great stuff, will definitely try this when my Mi 11 Ultra arrives. 90Hz is perfect for me, I don't need 120Hz as I don't play mobile games.
Anyone knows if it'll stay @ 90Hz after a software update? Or it will change itself back to 120Hz?

speedtripler said:
I read about a way, I think it was from another manufacturer , and it could lower the refresh rate down to 1hz when looking at a still image etc or a page of text etc , something that doesn't need to be constantly refreshed which would obviously be a major battery saver
If I can find the article again I'll post the link
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Maybe you refer to OnePlus 9 Pro, that has stock dynamic refresh rate...:
https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1371830276926668801

jericho246 said:
Great stuff, will definitely try this when my Mi 11 Ultra arrives. 90Hz is perfect for me, I don't need 120Hz as I don't play mobile games.
Anyone knows if it'll stay @ 90Hz after a software update? Or it will change itself back to 120Hz?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I would just take a quick look after an update. To be honest I don't know tho!

Thank you very much for the solution to change the refresh rate. It works perfectly.
Even if after the upgrade will revert to 120, you can change it afterwards very easy.
Cheers !

How to change refresh rate manually using only default.prop file? Thanks.

One other cool thing I found.
If you set it to 90/90 ( user refresh/peak refresh) like instructed above, i saw that it also drops to 60 when seeing static web browser page content ( for example reading this forum pages ) which is actually pretty cool because it saves even more power this way.
Will test to see if it does the same with the default 120hz but i rear think 120hz is overkill for daily usage.
Only scenario where I can find it useful would be games that support 100hz plus refresh rates .
LE it would seem that the "dynamic" refresh only worked briefly until I clicked on the auto brightness icon in the drop down menu.
LE 2 it actually switching to 60hz when brightness is around and over 80%
Take care and thanks again !

lebigmac said:
How to change refresh rate manually using only default.prop file? Thanks.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
What do you mean?youbcan change the settings in the Meue ofc but only 60hz and 120hz. The file is actually stock, you only changing the numbers and can changed them back any time you want
Best regards

Jhonxs said:
One other cool thing I found.
If you set it to 90/90 ( user refresh/peak refresh) like instructed above, i saw that it also drops to 60 when seeing static web browser page content ( for example reading this forum pages ) which is actually pretty cool because it saves even more power this way.
Will test to see if it does the same with the default 120hz but i rear think 120hz is overkill for daily usage.
Only scenario where I can find it useful would be games that support 100hz plus refresh rates .
LE it would seem that the "dynamic" refresh only worked briefly until I clicked on the auto brightness icon in the drop down menu.
LE 2 it actually switching to 60hz when brightness is around and over 80%
Take care and thanks again !
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Thx for your reply. Did you already test it out? I was quite busy the last days - sorry for my late response.
Honestly 120hz are kinda gimmick right now. You can feel the difference but it's draining even more battery and like you said as long as there is near to no app supporting it it's just something to be proud of maybe haha
Best regards
Lol you already did test it out . sorry

If anyone find a way to dynamically change the refresh rate please let us know.
For example when watching YT videos maxed at 60hz would be great to scale the display to that resolution ( if it's already possible please let me know )
I saw that the game "The elder scrools: Blades" automatically switches to 60Hz when playing ( haven't tested out with other games because i don't game that much ) .
Also i noted that, if, for whatever reason, the display doesn't change to 60HZ when the game needs it, the game will continuously load and never enter the actual first menu
A quick fix is to increase the brightness over 80% so that the screen is already at 60 before starting the game
Cheers !

Thanks @speedtripler. I just disabled animations in developer options and it's like sh*t off a shovel!
Cheers
Steve

Question Is there way to get the screen to stay at 144hz?

I love this phone, but there is one huge annoyance, there doesn't seem to be a way to make the screen actually run at a sustained framerate.
I have it set to 144hz in the menu, but it routinely drops to 60fps or 120fps depending on the app
This normally isn't a big problem, except nova launcher only runs at 60fps and so scrolling the app drawer is incredibly bad.
Pokemon Go also only runs at 60fps...and since the game operates at 1/2 vsyn, the effective fps is only 30, which is atrocious compared to the 72fps it runs at on the ROG6

Don't confuse Screen Refresh Rate and Frames Per Second. Totally different things.

jwoegerbauer said:
Don't confuse Screen Refresh Rate and Frames Per Second. Totally different things.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I mean... Not really
Obviously the screen always runs at a refresh rate of 144hz because it isn't a VRR display(as far as I know that doesn't exist on phones)
So what you are changing in settings is always the frame rate that the phone is rendering at.
Your phone should ALWAYS be rendering at the frame rate you select in the settings menu... But this phone doesn't seem to do that, and it's annoying because it makes the usage experience worse than every other phone I have

BigDog87 said:
I mean... Not really
Obviously the screen always runs at a refresh rate of 144hz because it isn't a VRR display(as far as I know that doesn't exist on phones)
So what you are changing in settings is always the frame rate that the phone is rendering at.
Your phone should ALWAYS be rendering at the frame rate you select in the settings menu... But this phone doesn't seem to do that, and it's annoying because it makes the usage experience worse than every other phone I have
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Most of the reviews I've read/watched confirm what you've said. When you set 144hz, it runs that way in the default launcher and all the menus, but when you open certain apps, if they don't support 144hz natively then they just don't run at 144hz. The reviews seem to indicate that the developers of said apps need to enable support for 144hz.

So I was poking around the settings, and entered developer mode. There's an option to force the screen to stay at 144hz at ALL TIMES. It's called LOCK REFRESH RATE. I was able to confirm this works because there is also an option to SHOW REFRESH RATE which displays the screen refresh rate in the upper corner of the display. Before I locked the refresh rate, I used the show refresh rate function to view the refresh rate using different apps. In the phone menus, and app drawer, and google feed, etc the phone would remain at 144hz. But when opening some apps like Chrome for example, the refresh rate would drop to 120hz, etc. However, when I LOCKED the refresh rate in the dev options, the screen refresh rate stayed at 144hz in EVERY app and scenario I was in. It does state that this will drain your battery more rapidly when selecting to lock the refresh rate in the developer options. FYI

Question Mi 11 120hz Locked

hello so the same problem i had trying to figure out the huge battery drain while i had 38% on(other apps)
on that process i found out that the screen never goes to 60hz,only on tik tok
on 12.5.9 and miui 13 android 12 too,when always on display too,does anyone please have a clue?this is ridiculous..thnx!

If you have approximately 1.09€ for buy a great apps, it's SmartHertz and you will choose refresh rate for everything, apps, games, launcher at 60/90/120hz
I encourage all Mi 11 users to support Miguel (the dev) because this apps working perfectly on Mi 11 (AOSP or MIUI, A11 or A12)
A must have, exactly what you want

Pho3nX said:
If you have approximately 1.09€ for buy a great apps, it's SmartHertz and you will choose refresh rate for everything, apps, games, launcher at 60/90/120hz
I encourage all Mi 11 users to support Miguel (the dev) because this apps working perfectly on Mi 11 (AOSP or MIUI, A11 or A12)
A must have, exactly what you want
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Exactly well said, that app is great and works perfectly for MIUI 13!

Pho3nX said:
If you have approximately 1.09€ for buy a great apps, it's SmartHertz and you will choose refresh rate for everything, apps, games, launcher at 60/90/120hz
I encourage all Mi 11 users to support Miguel (the dev) because this apps working perfectly on Mi 11 (AOSP or MIUI, A11 or A12)
A must have, exactly what you want
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Purchased few days a go....working like a charm on stable miui 13...based on your recommendation

Pho3nX said:
If you have approximately 1.09€ for buy a great apps, it's SmartHertz and you will choose refresh rate for everything, apps, games, launcher at 60/90/120hz
I encourage all Mi 11 users to support Miguel (the dev) because this apps working perfectly on Mi 11 (AOSP or MIUI, A11 or A12)
A must have, exactly what you want
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Also bought this app and it works great
the only thing not working is 60Hz on AOD/Lock screen > I always have 120Hz on AOD/lockscreen
AOD drains so much battery in its default 120Hz setting, I had to disable it..

Furma said:
Also bought this app and it works great
the only thing not working is 60Hz on AOD/Lock screen > I always have 120Hz on AOD/lockscreen
AOD drains so much battery in its default 120Hz setting, I had to disable it..
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Drain less by put AOD option :
- less luminosity AOD (but unlock is more slow)
- not display AOD on Raise up but only Wake up

thnx but the problem is that the phone itself should lower the herz on its own not forcing it by myself
also isnt this app forcing 60hz or 120hz per app?it doesnt lower it when you stop scrolling or on aod,i have 120hz on aod for no reason!

GennaiosFX said:
thnx but the problem is that the phone itself should lower the herz on its own not forcing it by myself
also isnt this app forcing 60hz or 120hz per app?it doesnt lower it when you stop scrolling or on aod,i have 120hz on aod for no reason!
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
LOL and ? Mi 11 as a Auto variable refresh rate BUT it's not a LTPO...
So when you are on Youtube or others apps with variable refresh rate enabled system change only between 60 to 120 hz... and a lot more 120 hertz, so you have lag and big drain. The refresh rate you want is for the new devices like Pixel 6 Pro or new Xiaomi 12, Samsung S22+ Pro...
And FYI 120hz for AOD is not for nothing, 120hz is putted by system when screen on/FOD on for maximize unlock speed (and high brightness on the FOG print also).
SmartHertz add features permit to choose refresh rate by app 60/90/120 or all 90hz all the time, but never you will convert a non LTPO screen to LTPO, you can seel your Mi 11 now. Blame Xiaomi, not us.

Pho3nX said:
LOL and ? Mi 11 as a Auto variable refresh rate BUT it's not a LTPO...
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Even if it isn't an LTPO panel, it's still a good idea to reduce refresh rate when a static image is viewed.
GennaiosFX said:
thnx but the problem is that the phone itself should lower the herz on its own not forcing it by myself
also isnt this app forcing 60hz or 120hz per app?it doesnt lower it when you stop scrolling or on aod,i have 120hz on aod for no reason!
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Also, I noticed that at high brightness (roughly 80% and above) adaptive refresh rate works somewhat better. It switches to 60hz when not scrolling, for example. I can only guess it's either bad implementation by Xiaomi or the display isn't able to switch reliably at lower brightness without flickering.

GennaiosFX said:
thnx but the problem is that the phone itself should lower the herz on its own not forcing it by myself
also isnt this app forcing 60hz or 120hz per app?it doesnt lower it when you stop scrolling or on aod,i have 120hz on aod for no reason!
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
MIUI does not have very good VRR implementation :
- AOD and Lock screen are by default always on 120Hz
- Majority of apps have fixed refresh rate (for example, youtube only works in 60Hz) and refresh rate does not change if you scroll or stop scrolling in an app
This is purely a Xiaomi issue + Mi11 display (first gen LTPO Samsung display) allows only for switching between 60-90-120Hz
Its not really flexible, especially comapred to 2nd gen LTPO displays which can go from 1-120Hz
with SmartHertz app at least you can force apps to run at lower fixed refresh rate (instead of most apps running at max 120Hz) + also it gives you option of choosing 60, 90 or 120Hz for every app (MIUI only gives you choice of 60 or 120Hz)