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Hi all,
I think it's fantastic that Barack Obama is President Elect of USA.
As this is an international forum I thought it would be interesting to see whether there is a difference of opinion between US Citizens, and those outside the US. I am British.
What do you think of Barack Obama's success in the election? What are your hopes, expectations, fears and concerns about for his administration?
It would be helpful for the purpose of discussion to state whether or not you are a US Citizen if it's not in your profile.
Cheers,
andrew-in-woking
I am a U.S. citizen and I believe it's a great thing. I'm not so sure he'll be the greatest man ever to be elected to office, but I know we dodged a bullet by not electing McCain/Palin. Imagine George Bush with a Vice President that considers herself experienced in foreign relations because she lives across the Bering Straight from Siberia... What a joke.
I live in the south and I think that the old days of the racist guard are over. It's an amazing thing, and I have a gut feeling he could be a historic president outside of the black thing. I was over joyed last night and even got a little misty eyed...and this is coming from someone who is a staunch Nader supporter. It's so amazing to see my state go blue!
burgertime said:
I live in the south and I think that the old days of the racist guard are over. It's an amazing thing, and I have a gut feeling he could be a historic president outside of the black thing. I was over joyed last night and even got a little misty eyed...and this is coming from someone who is a staunch Nader supporter. It's so amazing to see my state go blue!
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Sir, I commend you and your state... From the south, you still turned up blue. It's great to see states like NC and VA (who hadn't voted Democrat in over 40 years) making the right decision. This election has renewed a bit of the faith I had lost in the American people as a whole, the ability to see beyond race and beyond the fancy credentials and realize what this nation really needs. Congratulations to all Americans, and let's just wait for the day... What is it, 01/20/2009? This was one hell of a first election for me, great way to start voting.
I'm in Italy, very far from US, and maybe i dont know anythiiii...
But from first sight, i did non trust McCain. I was more disappointed, when i saw Madame Palin.
Cannot say i trust Obama, as i dont know his politic history; but i thik he's better.
We will see in the near future.
I think the idea of this being a "historic" election is over rated, and also the most racially charged one. There is no way anybody can convince me there wasn't a large voting block that voted for Obama purely on the bases they considered him "black". It should be written in the history books the US elected a mixed race president. To label him "black" is a slap in the face of his "white" mother.
I for one am sick of the concept of "race". I reject the racial color lines and do not subscribe to any race other than the human race. There will be forever racial tension as long as we label ourselves "black" or "white". It's time we give up our whiteness or blackness, and everything in between. It creates division and doesn't promote any unity.
Having said all that, I will support the new president and wish him well. My only fear is, it doesn't matter who is president, it's our senators and congressmen that controll this country's destiny. And unfortunately they are controlled by the highest bidder.
Hi,
I'm from Austria and watched the whole election night on CNN Int. and other local senders. I think its a very good first step. Obama can't do it any worse than Bush did it the past 8 years and I think he will be better than McCain too. There's a chance that the US now can fix their broken image in the world and fix their problems in the country itself. Hope it works.
One more thing: I didn't consider McCain to be a big problem as president, but I didn't like to see Palin as vicepresident. You can say what you want, but with 72 years theres a higher risk to become unfit to be president, than with 47. And in that case Palin would have been a disaster for both, the world and the US - imho.
So, my best wishes to the US citizens. I think it was the right choice.
chalid said:
Hi,
I'm from Austria and watched the whole election night on CNN Int. and other local senders. I think its a very good first step. Obama can't do it any worse than Bush did it the past 8 years and I think he will be better than McCain too. There's a chance that the US now can fix their broken image in the world and fix their problems in the country itself. Hope it works.
One more thing: I didn't consider McCain to be a big problem as president, but I didn't like to see Palin as vicepresident. You can say what you want, but with 72 years theres a higher risk to become unfit to be president, than with 47. And in that case Palin would have been a disaster for both, the world and the US - imho.
So, my best wishes to the US citizens. I think it was the right choice.
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That's exactly what it comes down to... I don't think Obama is our Lord and savior, I simply think he's better for the country than another George Bush. McCain loved to say "they say I vote with George Bush 90% of the time, but I'm not George Bush." Well obviously you're not, but ****, 9 out of 10 is 9 out of 10! 10% better than the last 8 years is not good enough.
It's a disaster unless you'll be one who will enjoy the benefits of socialism. "Spreading the wealth" isn't something that helps the economy or promotes job growth. Raising taxes stifles the economy and increases dependency on government programs.
So whether it's a good thing or not is subjective to whether you make money or take money.
I have a job. His proposed tax changes will hurt me more than help me and I don't make that much money. And by "not much" I mean not much more than a full time wal-mart checkout person.
-Mc
Black93300ZX said:
I simply think he's better for the country than another George Bush.
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He didn't run against George Bush. So a vote for Obama was NOT a vote against George Bush.
McHale said:
He didn't run against George Bush. So a vote for Obama was NOT a vote against George Bush.
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Did you read what else I said? You're right, McCain isn't George Bush, he's 90% of George Bush.
GWelker62 said:
I think the idea of this being a "historic" election is over rated, and also the most racially charged one. There is no way anybody can convince me there wasn't a large voting block that voted for Obama purely on the bases they considered him "black". It should be written in the history books the US elected a mixed race president. To label him "black" is a slap in the face of his "white" mother.
I for one am sick of the concept of "race". I reject the racial color lines and do not subscribe to any race other than the human race. There will be forever racial tension as long as we label ourselves "black" or "white". It's time we give up our whiteness or blackness, and everything in between. It creates division and doesn't promote any unity.
Having said all that, I will support the new president and wish him well. My only fear is, it doesn't matter who is president, it's our senators and congressmen that controll this country's destiny. And unfortunately they are controlled by the highest bidder.
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Many Republicans and Democrats vote straight ticket, this is no different then a black man voting solely on race. They are both dumb reason to vote. That being said I just can't see how anyone can say this is not historical. I agree with you on the labels thing though.
McHale said:
It's a disaster unless you'll be one who will enjoy the benefits of socialism. "Spreading the wealth" isn't something that helps the economy or promotes job growth. Raising taxes stifles the economy and increases dependency on government programs.
So whether it's a good thing or not is subjective to whether you make money or take money.
I have a job. His proposed tax changes will hurt me more than help me and I don't make that much money. And by "not much" I mean not much more than a full time wal-mart checkout person.
-Mc
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You're right, we should stay in Iraq for another decade like McCain wants, spending $12 billion a month, I'm sure that'll lead to tax cuts... Oh wait, how does that math work? Oh that's right, it doesn't. Considering Obama said the only tax hikes will be for people with $250k+ salaries, I don't think your "not much better than Wal-Mart salary" will suffer as much as you think. I guess you can call me a taker, because I, along with much more than half of the planet, forget our country, agree that Obama is a much better selection. Stop listening to the McCain campaign and what daddy tells you, tax hikes for higher paid citizens is not socialism, look it up.
burgertime said:
Many Republicans and Democrats vote straight ticket, this is no different then a black man voting solely on race. They are both dumb reason to vote. That being said I just can't see how anyone can say this is not historical. I agree with you on the labels thing though.
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I don't recall many times Obama mentioned in his campaign that he was black, he didn't use it as a leverage point at all. That's why the likes of Jesse Jackson and Al Sharpton failed so miserably in their political escapades, it was all about race. With Obama, he showed how he can change the nation, not with his skin color but with his intelligence and his views... McCain just brought up being held captive 5 decades ago and hoped that would pull him through.
McHale said:
"Spreading the wealth" isn't something that helps the economy
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Actually it does. The more money people have the more they can spend, which for sure will boost the economy.
Socialism. What is that exactly? Please explain
And another thing: Its true Obama didn't run against Bush, but McCain did. If there weren't the last 8 years McCain could have won this. But unfortunately for him, Bushs politics failed over and over again, which naturally strengthened all political enemies. And one of those is Barack Obama.
GWelker62 said:
I think the idea of this being a "historic" election is over rated, and also the most racially charged one. There is no way anybody can convince me there wasn't a large voting block that voted for Obama purely on the bases they considered him "black". It should be written in the history books the US elected a mixed race president. To label him "black" is a slap in the face of his "white" mother.
I for one am sick of the concept of "race". I reject the racial color lines and do not subscribe to any race other than the human race. There will be forever racial tension as long as we label ourselves "black" or "white". It's time we give up our whiteness or blackness, and everything in between. It creates division and doesn't promote any unity.
Having said all that, I will support the new president and wish him well. My only fear is, it doesn't matter who is president, it's our senators and congressmen that controll this country's destiny. And unfortunately they are controlled by the highest bidder.
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Very well said sir. I actually did not vote for either of the two more popular candidates. I agree "there will be forever racial tension as long as we label ourselves "black" or "white." Why can't we all be called Americans. Isn't that what makes American great? That no matter where you came from or what ethnicity you are, you are still an American first. Not Mexican American or African American, Asian American, Italian American, German American, etc. why not just be American.
I agree that it is important to keep and cherish historic traditions and customs. Each different ethnic group brings something good to this country and it's important to recognize that. Maybe this election will help bring this country closer together. There is no doubt some real tension is surrounding this country. I would like nothing more than Americans to come together.
I for one will give Barack Obama a fair shot. In his speech last night he said, "And to those Americans whose support I have yet to earn – I may not have won your vote, but I hear your voices, I need your help, and I will be your President too."
His speech was excellent last night. He is a great orator and I am encouraged by his presence and hope that he does well. I trully do.
Black93300ZX said:
You're right, we should stay in Iraq for another decade like McCain wants, spending $12 billion a month, I'm sure that'll lead to tax cuts... Oh wait, how does that math work? Oh that's right, it doesn't. Considering Obama said the only tax hikes will be for people with $250k+ salaries, I don't think your "not much better than Wal-Mart salary" will suffer as much as you think. I guess you can call me a taker, because I, along with much more than half of the planet, forget our country, agree that Obama is a much better selection. Stop listening to the McCain campaign and what daddy tells you, tax hikes for higher paid citizens is not socialism, look it up.
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I agree with you. I never thought I would say that. We are spending way to much in Iraq and need to leave as soon as we can. I don't think that John McCain wanted to spend another decade in Iraq but that is neither here nor there now.
President Bush spent money like a Liberal. I have never seen a Republican candidate spend so much money. It's funny that Republicans run under the platform and spending but many of them as just as bad as there Liberal counterparts. I hope that Barack Obama reduces military expenditures like the one in Iraq and direct this attention to Afghanistan.
I am not however going to argue with you concerning the tax increases for people of 250k+. If he does that it will be curious to see what effect this will have on the real economy.
...but remember when you start taxing companies that will entice them to seek else where to incorporate. Which takes the jobs with them. I just hope that we can come to a middle ground because the real problem of America are not going to be settled overnight. With a clear majority in both the House and Senate the Democrats will have complete control of everything.
burgertime said:
That being said I just can't see how anyone can say this is not historical.
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I agree.... Just note I didn't say it wasn't historical, I said it was over rated.
GWelker62 said:
I agree.... Just note I didn't say it wasn't historical, I said it was over rated.
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Sorry read too fast!
McHale said:
It's a disaster unless you'll be one who will enjoy the benefits of socialism. "Spreading the wealth" isn't something that helps the economy or promotes job growth. Raising taxes stifles the economy and increases dependency on government programs.
So whether it's a good thing or not is subjective to whether you make money or take money.
I have a job. His proposed tax changes will hurt me more than help me and I don't make that much money. And by "not much" I mean not much more than a full time wal-mart checkout person.
-Mc
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Do realize that 90% of current America from around 1920 on has embraced socialist ideas?
Have you been to college? This is a socialist ideal, you give tuition which is then spread throughout to help out say a sports program you have nothing to do with. In turn the money the sports program makes is then spread (usually unequally) to academics. So are you also anti college because of it's evil socialist agenda?
How about police and fireman? They are paid through taxes which "share the wealth" to those agencies. Ever notice how some wealthy small towns have over the top police departments? This is because the "wealth" is being distributed there. Are you also against fireman and police?
How about your highway and roads? Should we abolish these because the "wealth is spread around"?
You would probably answer no to all three. So actually research stuff before you start making broad over dramatic statements about something you know nothing about. Americans have such a narrow view of socialism because of our involvement in Vietnam and our hastiness to decry anything slightly socialist.
Obama has socialist ideals, this makes him no more a socialist then you if you pay taxes or went/go to college.
I'm from Canada and I'm pretty happy with who won. Mind you...I'm a conservative at heart and always will be, but with the two men that were running, I think the best man for United States won. Years from now, history will tell us if it was a good thing or bad. Until such time, the storm has to be weathered.
...oh...and for those wondering, Canada is more or less a socialist country.
I hope this is okay mods/admins, if not, please trash.
I was going to add it to apost in a thread, but thought it would make people post just to share their remarks.
and i figured since this is the off-topic area that it'd be ok.
but I got the number sent to me in a text
that's in the quote i'm about to paste in here,
you can call to vote,
or go to the website to learn more about it.
i know some smokers on this site,
so i thought i'd post for all the other US smokers.
this is kinda my point of view in the quote
as i just posted it as a bulletin on my myspace.
so please don't get offended,
it's my oppinnion,
and we're all entitled to our opinnions,
and feel free to state yours,
but please do not fight over this topic,
as i know it can be controversial at times.
thanks, and here's the quote:
http://criminaljustice.change.org/actions/view/legalize_marijuana
to vote for the step towards legalization,
or call to vote: 9734093274
its a new jersey number.
It's bound tohappen sooner or later.
I'm for the industrial kind's legalization more so then the kind you smoke.
The industrial kind is what they used for the original constitution, rope, etc.
its usuable for like over 260,000 different genre's of products.
not 260,000 products, but genre's of products,
What I mean is, for example a sidekick is a product, a cell phone is the genre.
catch my drift, it's extremely useful.
and that's not the so called health stuff associated with it.
the industrial kind can be grown on 98% of the earth's surface.
the 2% that it cannot is at the north and south poles, but if you found dirt there,
it could grow.
it's estimated that one year cultivation/sale of the industrial kind can bring the United States completely out of debt and pay for almost all of the government bailouts. thats hundreds of trillions of dollars for out debt, and add hundred billions more for the bail outs.
that's a **** ton of money.
and that's not even the drug aspect of marijuana.
which would prolly make enough money for the rest of the government bailouts that the industrial kind couldn't pay off.
now should we american's be spending hundred of billions of dollars trying to fight marijuana each year, or should we embrace it and make money off of it?
also, fun fact, marijuana is illegal because of thc, but then why is Marinol legal even though it's synthetic THC? Gee, I wonder if it's because they can't control the growing of a natural plant....
Besides, isn't this america? here it's all about capitalism. so why shouldn't we capitalize on this product and make our country ****in ridiculously rich and then we can afford to help the nations in poverty and afford to keep everyone in america fed as well.
doesn't this just sound like such a better thing then spending billions of dollars on fighting this every year?
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Cotton
American people made too much money raping Africans and forcing them to pick cotton.
Hemp could have stopped that industry before it even started and lots of Rich people would potentially not be rich now......
I wonder how many household brand companies still exist that actually rose to positions of power during those times through the use of slavery. The mind boggles.!.
History is the biggest teacher and I think it will be a long time before people can look back and unravel (without any form of biased prejudice or some sort of adjenda) the reasons behind the criminalisation of Hemp and the pushing of tobbaco - alcohol and other taxable substances that cannot be grown perfectly and easily in your garden with a minimum of fuss. In the right environment, most people could grow a banging plant with polenty of smoke potential in their own gardens.
Life is hard, but could be so much better and easier if we all grew veggies and hemp.
The lure of the city and capitalism is starting to fade now, hopefully with more education and time people will understand that its better to grow natural food and weed than get on a commute everyday and take Ritalin.
No one else makes money if you stay in your community and become self sufficient though!!
If all people wanted was - Healthy food, excercise, good sex and a bit of chiung smoke for treat. The world would be a much better place.
Sadly, its much more socially acceptable to drink 5 pints of lager and start a fight that to smoke a big one and mong out. Sadly its more acceptable to go to war with another country than to back down and make a peaceful approach to every situation.
I dont think that big industry is the answer CodyBear. In fact, money is not the answer. Money is a representation of non critical resources. What do you need to live? Food, water and shelter. What is money? Oil and stones/gold etc........? I dont actually know what resources money represents now days.....How can my £10 note represent anything when our government is in so much debt to the Fund?
(same for USA -except its in much more debt)
I seriously dont share a vision of the future where every one works in a big factory. I desperately search for a vision of the future where communities are self contained and completely self suffiecient, clean and green
Ho-hum I am not holding my breath - not until I win the euro lottery and buy my own island!!
This is waayy off-topic, This is a still a phone forum.
Legal & political discussions just stir up bad feelings. If you want to discuss this I think you'd be better in a another forum
Thread Closed
Dave
http://www.myfox8.com/business/sns-rt-us-appletre77n82k-20110824,0,7184764.story
Also on Engadget.
Wow.
I'm starting to wonder if his health is getting worse.
Don't care
Sad to see. I just hope that his health gets better.
Just think how much their stock would have plummeted if they hadn't bottled it and suspended trading beforehand.
I'm thinking his cancer has returned and he's nearing the end.
-Sent from my Droid Incredible-
xaccers said:
Just think how much their stock would have plummeted if they hadn't bottled it and suspended trading beforehand.
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I think Apple will be fine for the next few years. Good time to buy Apple stock.
The news is kind of sudden though, I hope Steve is okay.
bleach168 said:
I think Apple will be fine for the next few years. Good time to buy Apple stock.
The news is kind of sudden though, I hope Steve is okay.
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Oh as a company they'll be fine, but last time he took ill their stock dropped a fair bit.
With him actually leaving it would have dropped considerably, therefore temporarily devaluing the company.
I hope he gets well also, cancer is a very..very tough battle.
Though I'm not a big fan of Apple products still sad to see this happen, the type of things Apple produced during his time there were amazing.
Hope he gets better.
As much as im not a fan of crapple i wish Steve nothing but the best. "Maybe patent wars will stop now??" says the troll. The answer is no...Steve was just a puppet leader....sort of like Manchuria in the 40-70's. The decisions were made by the legal team so i've got nothing against him.
I don't agree with the way he goes about business, but I never wish harm upon another human being. Hope if his resignation is related to his health issues that they make a turn for the better without the responsibilities that come with a position like he was holding... it's amazing how detrimental a high stress job can be to your health.
Certainly one of the most iconic businessmen of his age. Hats off to Steve.
Always saw him as the soul behind Apple.
dont care.. but hope he gets better
YAY! Apple is doomed
without Steve, Apple is not much of a competition
Apple is going to slowly fade into the background just like Windows Mobile did, and PalmOS, and WebOS and all other that came before it
I wonder what would be the next big OS to challenge Android after this.
Steve rescued Apple from the blink of bankruptcy... actually they did, but it was thanks to Microsoft they stayed afloat
so Steve introduced the coloured toiled looking iMacs, and that was a crazy hit, then it came the iPod, that scored them big time, with the introduction to iTunes, to make music downloading easy for n00bs
with the success of iPod the went beyond to develop iPod touch, which was Apple's pre-staging to launch iPhone, they used iPod touch to sort out all the bugs, and get things close to perfect before releasing iPod touch
that was another big score for Apple, at that time there was no much competition from either front for music / phones
Apple's finally launched the iPhone, and well the world went wild after that, and with the introduction later to the AppStore, things got even more exiting, still no competition at the time.
That's how Apple surfed the big waves, and kept racking in money when no body else had good stuff in the market.
back at those times Windows Mobile was ... better than crap, PalmOS was dying, if not done for already. WebOS was barely born, and Android was just a pre beta/alpha stage.
Steve excelled at marketing ideas and presentation, but none of it was fresh or new, he just made it look better.
Everything that Apple released was already existing in the market, just never popularized by any marketing team of any company.
That's the power of marketing
get everyone hyped up, and you get tons of sales, specially target the young audiences, and make everything hip.
that's a good lesson that Google learned well and applied to their products and brand.
Completely agree, besides their company policy is really NASTY, so even if their products may be cool I would never buy/buyed any fruit products.
Apple: Learn to make fare competition or you will fail soon!
Doomed? Stop playing with your Nexus and do your homework son Gizmodo is covering this pretty well:
- The Life Of Steve Jobs - So Far
- Why Steve Jobs Chose the Perfect Time to Resign
- Apple without Steve Jobs Scares the **** out of Wall Street (Updated)
I am not a fan on jobs business practices or ios, but he saved apple and I respect him for that. I hope this move allows him to recover from his ailments.
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Jobs lost his job ...... Too soon?
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End of an era. Great CEO, like him or not. Sad
I truly hope He gets well very soon. That being said, I don't approve of his business methods or his "my way or the highway" attitude about his products....one of millions of reasons I won't buy fruit branded anything
All your OT are belong to Pipsqueak
@MODS: I know that there's a condolence thread for Mr Jobs, so I started this one to discuss his legacy, and what people think about him here instead.
#warning: No profanity, no tasteless jokes, minimal snark, no flaming. <- mods help me.
I'll start:
While I disagreed with how he handled iPhone 4 and iOS in general, you can't deny that he did have a tremendous impact on the way smartphone and smartphone OS is designed.
Taking a look at Android's history and you'll realize that as the iPhone got popular, Android phones start to look more and more like an iPhone, but we finally eclipsed both the iPhone an iOS by the Gingerbread era. Without the competition, Android certainly would not have moved in this direction, and so fast. I have said this many times before, and it warrants a repetition; I wished iPhone 5 came out so that Android manufacturers up their game.
Another area is the design aesthetics that Jobs pioneered in Apple. Look around and you'll realize that Dell, Lenovo and Samsung are building laptops that compete with the MacBook Air.
Now, onto the bad part... I hated him for making the Mac a walled garden, and for imposing a "Mac Tax" on all Apple products. Towards the end of his life/career, even Apple got nervous and started to push for litigation instead of innovation.
In the end, I have nothing but respect for the man, and I hope that there will be more innovators like him.
Didn't he half ass run apple into the ground prior to leaving and coming back when the iPod got big?
I don't entirely agree with apples business practices but you have to give them credit for selling their products for much more than their worth while creating a cult following around their products.
He knew how to play on people's love of a pretty UI. Steve Jobs has my respect.
Sent from my rooted and debloated X2!
T3HBR1AN said:
Didn't he half ass run apple into the ground prior to leaving and coming back when the iPod got big?
I don't entirely agree with apples business practices but you have to give them credit for selling their products for much more than their worth while creating a cult following around their products.
He knew how to play on people's love of a pretty UI. Steve Jobs has my respect.
Sent from my rooted and debloated X2!
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iMac; "pretty" computers for "creative" people, buy one and you too can feel like you're a special "creative" person. Share in the magic(TM) that is iMac
It was the start of the "lets see how much we can rip saps off for" project that apple ran after cancelling it's "lets try and help those in need" projects in 1994.
They found there were a hell of a lot of saps which could be ripped off a hell of a lot, often with the help of other saps which had been ripped off by Apple and apparently grateful for it.
OK, I know we rip on iOS and Apple/Mac all the time but, I think it's appropriate we pay our respects to the man.
Everyone please post a R.I.P. Steve Jobs
R.I.P Steve Jobs
I actually have huge respect for Apple products, and especially Steve Jobs. The unified ecosystem from Mac to iPhone to iPad is amazing. As a fan of unix, I actually own a MBP and iMac. I also own an iPad2, and the wife has a couple iPod classics (she has a lot of music).
I am not a huge fan of the iPhone, screen size, iOS doesn't do it for me, etc. But it is one of the best phones ever made, and is perfect for many people.
As for Steve Jobs, guy was one of the most influential people of the last 30 years. He revolutionized the PC market, and had he not been ousted at Apple, the PC market likely would be more like 80% Mac and 20% Windows, if that for Windows. Guy was a genius, especially when it came down to leading a team and coming up with a single product that could solve a problem none of us knew we had, but was very real.
R.I.P. Steve Jobs
R.I.P Steve Jobs
I was never personally a huge fan of Apple products (bad luck with iPhone and iPod video). It is pretty obvious that the man had a huge impact on personal computers as well as the current state of smart phones in the world.
Well really when you look at the big picture, Steve Jobs is the reason smart phones came into being and blew up into what they are today. He started the tablet revolution which A LOT of other companies have been trying to do for over a decade. Some people acted like he was this evil figure head of some horrible company but, the man was an innovator and was there with Bill Gates way back in the beginning. He had a very large part in everything that we do as far as computers and communications go. So, tonight I drink a beer to Steve Jobs.
lol at those crazy Westboro baptists protesting at his funeral.
Apparently they sent out a mass text to their fellow lunatics from none other than an iPhone.
The irony is a thing of beauty really
Without Steve, I probably wouldn't be holding my android right now. He pushed technology forward. He created a device that most of us use everyday! And he WAS one of the best CEO's ever.
R.I.P. STEVE JOBS
Sent from my Inspire 4 geee