hi....
im highly keen on gettin the diamond2 when it comes out (due to the guaranteed free upgrade to 6.5, and for under £400 there isn't much else that rivals it (correct me on this tho if i'm unaware of any rivals!))
BUT. doing research on the chipset i've heard and seen all sorts of posts about bad drivers for the qualcomm chipset that was used in the first touch diamond, about how the video performance was terrible, and how they underperformed compared to much older chips!
So........does anyone know whether the video performance of this diamond2 will be better/whether HTC have fixed these issues/whether the qualcomm chipset in the diamond2 is different to the one in the 1st diamond, or if its been updated or what?
basically.......is the phone going to work as expected! i currently have an ipaq 614c with an intel chipset, PXA270. I mean...is the qualcomm chipset in the diamond2 better??
iv'e also heard that the htc touch HD solved a lot of the problems or something because it had better drivers? if this is true.............the specs on the htc website show the touchHD as having a Qualcomm MSM 7201A. Whereas the Htc touch diamond2 has a Qualcomm MSM 7200A. Now..........whats the difference. Is the 7201A the decent correct chipset with good video performance (if all of the above is true), and the 7200 the crappy one??
until i have answers to all these questions.....i won't be able to focus on university
I think the 7201A is the a 7200 with certain features that would infrnge some US patents deactiviated.
Could be wrong?
The MSM7201A is just like the MSM7200, Graphics wise. Only difference is that HTC adds a "driver" for their so-called 3D...
Look into the Blackstone forums to see for yourself about the performance of the MSM7201A chipset. Then decide if you're still going to buy it. (I wouldn't, although i've got a Blackstone)
no MSM7200a is the world version
which include the ability to recoard vga at 30fps and the world 3g frequescies
MSM7201A is the american version which don't include the 30fps video capture because of a patent by broadcom and it use the american 3g frequescies
this is pure chip hardware and dont have anything to do with what
drivers htc provide
Rudegar said:
no MSM7200a is the world version
which include the ability to recoard vga at 30fps and the world 3g frequescies
MSM7201A is the american version which don't include the 30fps video capture because of a patent by broadcom and it use the american 3g frequescies
this is pure chip hardware and dont have anything to do with what
drivers htc provide
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Hmm I live in France, bought a Touch HD, and got a MSM7201a chipste on my device from Orange France. Nothing related to the american market here.
Maybe I'm wrong, but I can do 3G with my phone so...
The last a in MSM7201a and MSM7200a indicates that it's a 528 MHz version, without a it's 400 MHz. I've read that HTC went back to the MSM7200a version because of the poor video recording performance on the MSM7201a chip. So, I guess it may be older, but it's better. That's why both the D2 and the Pro2 get that one.
I guess the chipset could be allright. But HTC hasn't been all that good in providing proper drivers (so it seems).
Although I'm beginning to wonder if the Qualcomm chipsets are actually able to do good 2d and 3d graphics.
For example, when comparing it to a Samsung Omnia with a 624mhz Marvell it's really a world of difference. Ofcourse the Omnia has a smaller resolution (wqvga instead of vga) but it's much much faster than my Diamond (in about everything).
Especially when playing a movie or something with quite a high resolution (divx for example). It's much faster than the Diamond, and usually plays everything without any problem. Even compared to a Diamond with Coreplayer (for the Qualcomm video support).
So.. in short. I would not quite put all my hope on HTC delivering some magical drivers which increase performance a lot.
I rather think the Diamond2 will be much like the original Diamond. But with extra software features like a new TouchFLO 3D and some extra/other hardware features.
Looking at HTC's track record I doubt 'new high performance qualcomm drivers' is not one of the new software features.
edit: Btw, obviously don't take my word on this. I'd say if you are interested in a Diamond2, wait for it to be available and give it a nice test run. Check it out for yourself and see if you like it and think the speed is good enough for you. In the end that's all what counts, if you are happy with your/the device or not!
Like you said , the Omnia is only 400x240 with a CPU clocked 100mhz higher. The msm7201a in the diamond is running slower and has to push X2.74 more pixels! (and 3x more on the wvga phones). it has nothing to do with drivers (the majority doesn't seem to understand that) now regarding video perf that's another story. Coreplayer support HW accel on the Omnia (PXA cpu) but not on the Qualcomm chips (the Qtv mode is only a hack to accel DDdraw overlay) Only
WMP/HTc album support HW accel (and only on MP4 files).
I'm certainly not expecting any dramatic speed enhancements from the D2. And like I said, the difference between the 00 and the 01 is, as I read elsewhere, the video recording speed, not the playback.
Take a look here
http://www.glbenchmark.com/compare.jsp
Clearly HTC devices for some reason perform worse than 3 year old devices. These new devices will be no different as they are based on the same hardware. HTC are a joke.
So whats a good handy with good 2D/3D performance and Windows Mobile on it?
So...
Moby2kBug said:
So whats a good handy with good 2D/3D performance and Windows Mobile on it?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I think the toshiba G01 with an 1Ghz Snapdragon CPU,
the HTC "Superstar" with Nvidia chipset
the HTC "Star" with Snapdragon CPU
the Acer F1 with an 800Mhz Snapdragon CPU and an ATI co-processor
Add if I missed one
All of them should run 3D-games etc. well
I would take the F1 from Acer, because it's sleek and elegant designed and only priced at 560€.
take a look: http://translate.google.com/transla...apdragon-cpu.html&sl=nl&tl=en&history_state0=
I've been playing around with Coreplayer by watching TV programs recorded by Vista media centre from a network share. It plays the video at 31 fps and looks absolutely stunning.
Also, screen rotation from landscape to portrait is instantaneous.
I am not too worried about the chipset when I see this performance.
It records video in VGA no problems and plays back no problem - to me, it has no problem with Video
From what I have read the difference between the 7201a and the 7200a is the fab process: 90 vs 65. So the 7201a should be slightly more power efficient (although if it is only the CPU I don't know what the net difference will be).
Why they switched is a mystery. At first I assumed that it was related to their supply side situation: They have plants that can build 7200a and rather than revampt them, they released a few devices that use the 7200a rather than the 7201a.
Ingore that one - the Topaz and Rhodium each have the 7201a. The 7200a was a typo.
pidsw said:
From what I have read the difference between the 7201a and the 7200a is the fab process: 90 vs 65.
...snip...
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Nope That's what the "a" is for:
7200/7201 (not sure it exists): 90 nm process
7200a/7201a: 65 nm process
the 7201(if it exists)/7201a peculiarity is really due to a US patent. and this peculiarity is a downgrade...So if you have the choice between a 7200 and 7201, pick the 7200 if video recording is important to you, else pick randomly (or the cheaper ;-) ).
Whilst it may not be the fastest device in the world, for a 'Joke' company the reviews of the touch diamond2 are pretty good wouldnt you say?
Its a phone by the way!
PS. My touch diamond 2 has the 7200a, it says so in the 'Device information'
I don't have performance problems....movies in full DVD resolution are playing smooth, GPS lag isn't present, as on TD1...so I am copmpletely satisfied..
Actually speaking of GPS, it seems to work much much better on the TD2 than any others i have tried it against (kaiser/touch pro 2) I actually have close to full reception in buildings that the others wouldnt pick up on.
Video playback works great in media player with .mp4 files.
And the whole thing is just really responsive and fast at a stock rom vs the kaiser and touch pro 2.
Related
hello ,i m a french
I want know if somebody overclock diamond with a soft, and, if yes, is there some problems, or not, accelerate the 3D flow, and other appli...
...thank s
Hello, almost neighborou, I am Czech. I have Diamond for one day, but I spend hours findong some info - here is shortly what I know: Yes, Diamond has some Graphic Drivers, but still nothing exciting yet. It seems that 3D drivers are much better than 2D here. If you want a proof, a can say that on TyTN 2 in some bench thay gave 140 FPS, but Diamond gave only 80! Of course TyTN had experimental drivers. This means that Diamond has big reserves in performance, and they are waiting to be used. The 7201A dualcore CPU is basicly high-end technology theoretcally much better than Xscale CPUs, but its bad optimalised. (I heared that new Google phone will have one, but I am not sure). Yes, CoreCodec can use QTv, but now it is almost clear that Diamond has moch more to offer from HW. So, Oc will not help you, only new ROM can. There are many great pople and many ROM´s, and there is also preassure on HTC to come with better drivers, and personally I think it will be bigger and bigger, due to Touch Pro. So just wait, it take some time, but I trust there will be more power than you need sometimes.
Hi, I just found the specifications of the QTv - which has our Diamond. It is here: http://www.qctconnect.com/products/qtv.html , but I am scared a lot. They say "High performance decoding 15-30 fps at 32kbps - 384kbps" but, this seems like a joke. CPUs like Intel PXA 270 even on 312MHZ can do better, PXA 270 on same frequency as Diamond (520 for Xscale) can decode even 1.6 Mb/s video which is about 7 times more. So, this Qualcomm chip is a joke! 4 years old CPU can beat this new one. I am terrified.
i did compare the image quality with coreplayer with a directdraw device like those you mentioned with my htc touch pro and while the benchmark using the qtv driver gives around 150% (using the same video of course) the image quality is really alot better, if you put the 2 devices side by side you will notice a really bad to good quality.
BUT is you put the diamond/touch pro video driver has direct draw, you have the same "bad quality image" but 280% of benchmark power...
So you have to choose, good quality but ""less fps""" ( perfectly working for me since the benchmark shows it can accelerate iven more the video) or less quality gaining nothing...
that specs does reflect my real world testing !
@adolfotregosa: I could not comprehend your 2nd paragraph. How do you get 280% benchmark power (even if its "bad quality")?
@pokevitek: I agree with adolfotregosa - quality with QTv is much better when it comes to scaling. Material looks like it was the correct resolution while in reality it is a little lower.
And btw: please add CorePlayer to the title so that everybody knows what the hell you're talk about!
coreplayer with directdraw driver (the same driver that's used on the other cpus) can accelerate my test video 280% on the touch pro
For me QTv seems to be the fastest setting - and luckily the nicest (meaning on the Diamond).
Chatty said:
For me QTv seems to be the fastest setting - and luckily the nicest (meaning on the Diamond).
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Got to agree with Chatty - coreplayer with that setting can play TV and other source rips natively (dont have to convert) with hardly any frames dropped (even with stereo bluetooth audio)
Any other setting i've tried gives nowhere near the performance
Now, I am little bit off, so, you say, that Xscale CPUs has worse image quality than QTv mode in Coreplayer? With all seting same except render mode? I must ask, if you compared that image quality, did you compare VGA to VGA device? And, what score can do you second testing device in CorePlayer using DirectDraw? I mean 280% to ... % . Anyway, only thing I am scared from is, that specs says that Diamond/Pro can encode video with 380 kb/s TOP and that is bad, compared to other ones with 1.6 Mb/s TOP. And today, there is NO movie in 380kb/s, but about 1.2Mb/s. And last, QTv is fastest mode on Diamond/Pro, so how is it possible that you had abou 130% more with it?
Furbious said:
Got to agree with Chatty - coreplayer with that setting can play TV and other source rips natively (dont have to convert) with hardly any frames dropped (even with stereo bluetooth audio)
Any other setting i've tried gives nowhere near the performance
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
YES, this is what I say, specs on original Qualcomm site about MSM7201 says that QTv can encode up to 380kb/s! And you know that 380kb/s is NOTHING, it is like better MP3, but definetelly no like quality movie. And second, adolfotregosa said, that DirectDraw was about 280 comapred to QTv 150 % . And you just wrote that QTv is fastest. So, where is mistake?
Again, please adjust your thread title! (Push the edit button on your first post.)
My VGA avi's benchmark around 98% with QTv. DDraw 95%. Others below 90%.
pokevitek said:
...says that QTv can encode up to 380kb/s! ... And second, adolfotregosa said, that DirectDraw was about 280 comapred to QTv 150 % . And you just wrote that QTv is fastest. So, where is mistake?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
At first, QTv decodes! Second, adolfotregosa might have tried some special file, bad ROM, different background tasks while testing...
my compared a Eten m800 that only allows direct draw with my htc touch pro
The video was the avi file found on the net of this video.. OK OK i forgot to tell, i used 100% scale, not best fit so i would have a comparition between the kaiser (qvga and tytn II qtv) eten m800 VGA and touch pro vga, that's why i got 280% like on the kaiser. It has to be a fair test. Not just lunch a benchmark comparing a 320x240 screen to a 4x more pixel screen.. with the same settings the htc touch pro was the fastest. Final
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uyT1Lda9yPA
Ehm, no, this is not what I ment. Yes, I know, decodes, only word mistake, I know very well what is it. Next, I didnt want to edit thread name, becouse I mean that QTv specifications is a joke, I didnt mean CorePlayer etc... Just QTv technology. Next, adolfotregosa : I dont mean it bad, but I was talking about Intel Xscale CPUs, PXA 270,272,310,312... You compared Touch Pro to old Qualcomm CPU MSM7200, and Samsung CPU, in e-ten. Samsung is IMHO worst CPU for mebile devices, slowest. Qualcom MSM7200 is definetelly slow CPU. (compared To Xscale). But, there was a hope for Qualcomm, becou in many tests their 7201A can beat in spb benchmark even 624 MHz PXA 312 CPU. And that is NICE! And what is better, it is equal as 624 MHz PXA 312 in graphic benchmark. BUT, And what this thread is about - I just say, that Qualcomm says in 7201 specifications that QTv has High performance decoding 15-30 fps at 32kbps - 384kbps, but everyone know that 384 kb/s in really bad bitrate, so this Qualcomm chip is joke, becouse 384kb/s bitrate is for MP3, not for VGA video. That should have at least 1Mb/s bitrate. And like I said before, Xscale CPUs, even 4 years old can decode 1.6 Mb/s video, absolutelly smooth. 384kb/s - 1600kb/s ? CPU made in 2008 - CPU made in 2004? So, from this, it looks that Qualcomms QTv is very bad technology! Please discuss about this, abou QTv specifications, becouse I dont believe that this new chipset MSM7201 is so much worse than old PXA 270. Please read that Qualcomm page in my first post, and say something about it. I must did some mistake.
well did have a qtek 9000 a long time ago.. vga and intel @ 520 mhz and at that time my father had a tytn (samsung 400Mhz?? ) and god, it just cleaned the 9000, only if i put the cpu at 624 i could get close!
pokevitek i'm with you, ON paper the qualcomm sucks, on real life for me and it seams for more users , QTV it is just great !! better quality when compared to a intel cpu pda but not as fast ok.
Maybe you had high spectations on the device. I just came from a n95-8gb to a touch pro and man, what a diference!
Hi, I am just wondering, new Diamond 2 has 7200A CPU, but Diamond has 7201A CPU. I heard that 7200A has VGA video recording option, but is there some other difference? Like is 7200A faster in other thigs? Can it play videos faster than 7201A?
i think u are mistaken about diamond 2 cpu
diamond 2 still use msm 7201A
and msm 72xxA family still sucks when it comes to playing video
htc doesn't want to deliver the full potential of msm 72xxA cpu
its just my opinion though....
sorry 4 my bad english
albert_betet said:
i think u are mistaken about diamond 2 cpu
diamond 2 still use msm 7201A
and msm 72xxA family still sucks when it comes to playing video
htc doesn't want to deliver the full potential of msm 72xxA cpu
its just my opinion though....
sorry 4 my bad english
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Check the facts before you post. You are discrediting yourself. Diamond 2 does come with 7200A while Diamond comes with 7201A processor.
http://www.htc.com/europe/product/touchdiamond2/specification.html
http://www.htc.com/au/product/touchdiamond/specification.html
7200A is 90nm
7201A is 65nm
Is cheaper, may be preferred.
Because Diamond2, will be cheaper than Diamond.
albert_betet said:
and msm 72xxA family still sucks when it comes to playing video
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I agree to a degree but it seems like they've at least added hardware acceleration for MP4 video via media player... It handles MP4 video very well...
Lord_BlackAdder said:
Check the facts before you post. You are discrediting yourself. Diamond 2 does come with 7200A while Diamond comes with 7201A processor.
http://www.htc.com/europe/product/touchdiamond2/specification.html
http://www.htc.com/au/product/touchdiamond/specification.html
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
sorry
but in my region(SEA)
several days ago i checked the specs and it come with msm7201A!!!!
and today i checked again it revised to msm7200A??
weird
and i check the data in SEA region not europe,
maybe the sea region of htc post a little mislead about diamond 2 cpu specs
i dunno about that
owziee said:
I agree to a degree but it seems like they've at least added hardware acceleration for MP4 video via media player... It handles MP4 video very well...
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
yeah
fortunately there is a converter for diamond hd and it works like a charm with diamond
but i think diamond with wm player(or core player) should play all kind of video file(not hd though) without lag out of the box(without converter)
because there is ati gpu in there and 64mb reversed for graphical process
and the cpu is strong enough(i think.....) to handle the process
or maybe because WinMO doesn't like msm72xxA family?
Hello,
what are the differences between the two Chipsets in the Rhodium and the Rhodium W?
Thanks!
chris.computerfreak said:
Hello,
what are the differences between the two Chipsets in the Rhodium and the Rhodium W?
Thanks!
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I guess the MSM7600 is CDMA whilst the MSM7200 is GSM?
EDIT:
MSM7200 is GSM only
MSM7600 is GSM/CDMA dualmode, which would explain why the Sprint Rhodium FCC listing says it's got GSM disabled...
http://pdadb.net/index.php?m=cpu&id=a7600&c=qualcomm_msm7600
http://pdadb.net/index.php?m=cpu&id=a7200&c=qualcomm_msm7200
The AT&T GSM band version says: MSM7201a
http://www.engadgetmobile.com/photos/htcs-warhawk-and-fortress-are-atandts-touch-diamond2-and-pro2/2032864/
I really fancy a TP2 and I may be reading this completely wrongly, but . . .
my Touch Diamond has a MSM7201A processor which is newer than the processor in the TP2 and is 65nm technology, whereas the MSM7200A is 90nm
Have HTC done some form of tweaking to give better performance from the TP2 because if not it doesn't sound like a considerable upgrade on what I have now
utvol06 said:
The AT&T GSM band version says: MSM7201a
http://www.engadgetmobile.com/photos/htcs-warhawk-and-fortress-are-atandts-touch-diamond2-and-pro2/2032864/
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Look at that link, the last sentence at the bottom in red...
"WM 7.x refresh awarded with Sept 09 launch date"
This is exciting me. Is this hinting for Windows Mobile 7 this year September?
stunno said:
I really fancy a TP2 and I may be reading this completely wrongly, but . . .
my Touch Diamond has a MSM7201A processor which is newer than the processor in the TP2 and is 65nm technology, whereas the MSM7200A is 90nm
Have HTC done some form of tweaking to give better performance from the TP2 because if not it doesn't sound like a considerable upgrade on what I have now
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
MSM7201A is not newer than MSM7200A. They are the same generation processor. non-A is 90nm, A is 65nm. 0 is original chip, 1 is with patent workaround. 0 outperforms 1, patent workaround introduced some performance issues.
Laymans term, 7200A is 65nm and faster than 7201A.
TP2 = much faster than TP (probably mostly related to tweaks we had in our custom ROMs anyways, and faster flash and ram chips).
Why do I need to keep telling people this....
LilGBlood said:
Look at that link, the last sentence at the bottom in red...
"WM 7.x refresh awarded with Sept 09 launch date"
This is exciting me. Is this hinting for Windows Mobile 7 this year September?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
This is a typo, should be WM 6.x refresh, i.e. 6.5, which has been said to be released on actual phones in September for ages now.
By patent workarounds, may I hopefully assume it's concerning the hardware video acceleration part? If so, may I also hopefully assume the TP2 has some built in use of that part of the chipset??? Please.... My old HD is getting wore out and I need an excuse to upgrade
Thanks Chainfire... many respects...
Chainfire said:
...0 is original chip, 1 is with patent workaround. 0 outperforms 1, patent workaround introduced some performance issues.
Laymans term, 7200A is 65nm and faster than 7201A.
TP2 = much faster than TP ...
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
SomethingWicked said:
By patent workarounds, may I hopefully assume it's concerning the hardware video acceleration part? If so, may I also hopefully assume the TP2 has some built in use of that part of the chipset??? Please.... My old HD is getting wore out and I need an excuse to upgrade
Thanks Chainfire... many respects...
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
The patent issue AFAIK only has to do with some 3G stuff (I don't know how this relates to the performance issues of the 1 variant, though, I know there is something with that). Still TP2 does have HW 3D video - but so do the Diamond, TP, HD, and Diam2. The TP2 (and TD2) is noticably faster than the HD, though.
Chainfire said:
The patent issue AFAIK only has to do with some 3G stuff (I don't know how this relates to the performance issues of the 1 variant, though, I know there is something with that). Still TP2 does have HW 3D video - but so do the Diamond, TP, HD, and Diam2. The TP2 (and TD2) is noticably faster than the HD, though.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Actually, it would have been better if you could put some references about your comments. Especially this one: "Laymans term, 7200A is 65nm and faster than 7201A."
It seems you're right about patent issue (though it is hard to find anything about that), I found this site: http://www.scribd.com/doc/2140146/tag1202114pagenews1tQualcomm-Launches-UMTS-Chipsetsd578, which says:
" In December 2007, US federal judge issued an injunction against Qualcomm for infringement of three Broadcom patents and ordered it to stop selling 3G wideband code division multiple access (WCDMA) cellular chips that breach Broadcom patents. The company has launched the mobile station modem (MSM) 6271, MSM6281, MSM7201 and MSM7201A chipsets in the US. According to the company, the new chipsets are pin- and software-compatible with the existing product versions for easy transition. "
So if the site i'm referecing is reliable, then you're right about this.
But where did you get the info about the 65nm? Could you give us some references? The only site I found (where the size is mentioned) is this: http://pdadb.net/index.php?m=cpu&id=a7200a&c=qualcomm_msm7200a and it says it is 90nm.
What's more interesting that on this site: http://www.qctconnect.com/products/msm_7201.html#Technical Features It says: "Qcamcorder™: Record up to 24 fps QVGA"
Meanwile here: http://pdfserv.datasheetpro.net/QUALCOMM/msm7200a_chipset.pdf
"Qcamcorder™ Encoder
• A real-time wireless video recording solution that captures movies at 30 fps WVGA"
(this datasheet - by the way - mentions lots of interesting infos)
mydexterid said:
Actually, it would have been better ...
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Perhaps if you asked nicely. And even then I'm inclined to tell you to UTFS (it's not like this is "new" information)
EDIT: BTW, seems I didn't mention it in this thread - I did in another - it does indeed seem that the US TP2 (non-Sprint, which will use MSM7600 series) is MSM7201A, while the EU (and possibly Asia) versions use MSM7200A.
Did you guys forget Xperia X1? It also uses the same processor like the Touch Pro2.
A thread like this has been discussed in X1 forum. Sadly, it seemed like X1 has the worse performance of them all...
netsurfz said:
Did you guys forget Xperia X1? It also uses the same processor like the Touch Pro2.
A thread like this has been discussed in X1 forum. Sadly, it seemed like X1 has the worse performance of them all...
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Most of the performance gains are due to faster RAM/Flash ICs, not the processor.
Chainfire said:
Perhaps if you asked nicely. And even then I'm inclined to tell you to UTFS (it's not like this is "new" information)
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Yeah.. what I expected.. Layman...
Chainfire said:
Perhaps if you asked nicely. And even then I'm inclined to tell you to UTFS (it's not like this is "new" information)
EDIT: BTW, seems I didn't mention it in this thread - I did in another - it does indeed seem that the US TP2 (non-Sprint, which will use MSM7600 series) is MSM7201A, while the EU (and possibly Asia) versions use MSM7200A.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
And in just a few short hours i'll have mine in my grubby lil hands hehehe....
GOT TO GET ME DAT ANDROID NOW
[and its sprint - yey yey new cpu]
btw found some interesting things here:
http://www.datasheetpro.com/node/50272
gives some details on the 7600 chipset - very nice diagrams and whatnot
Found the datasheet on MSM7200A, would be pleased if any of you guys check it and compare it to iPhone graphics chip
Xperia proccessor MSM7200A, with integrated graphics chip
iPhone graphics chip PowerVR MBX-Lite (Sorry no datasheet)
Since the most popular (because of its app store, games quantity) is iPhone,
And I must say iPhone games are really superb for a graphics aspect, imo best graphics in mobile phones/pda/smartphones field. (like Sims 3, NFS Undercover), I wonder if Xperia could do the same.
In GSM arena, I discovered that iPhone graphics chip is Powervr MBX-Lite (On iPhone & iPhone 3G), featuring OpenGL ES 1.1, OpenVG 1.0, Direct3D and of course full 2D/3D support, which, compared MSM7200A integrated ATi accelaration, well, really Im not a Pro out here, so I've just found a Datasheet on this.
Not to tell about the WM gaming industry, which is ermm "....", but the fact, hope, that we could have this...
Now we have almost everything - itje, who dedicated very much to xda (his roms, other deeds are priceless) ((ofcourse his Touch-IT testing team, who not only answer touch-it related questions but is active like everyhwere)) other Rom and active app's/ xda contributors like gtrab, smaberg, jackleung,Tnyynt, fingerkeyboard makers, HTC encoder makers, other guys, fixing our phone bugs, creating soft for us,moderators... I could go on and on
naming these great people, who raised up our xperia from stock to almost perfection.
So only issue is...(for me ) gaming.
Heard that EA, gameloft are porting iPhone games to newer WM devices, but, I dont think that these sources are...well...realistic.
Tautvydas said:
Been looking in forums, web, to be precise, everywhere, even Xperia X1 White Paper, but Still havent got clarified answer on what Graphics chip does Xperia use. So I made several assumptions, by checking the information a little bit.
As common answer is Xperia uses ATI Imageon 2700, in Wikipedia there's no such chip number as "2700", also, Products with Imageon well, there's no xperia!
Imo, variants Xperia graphics chip is "Imageon 2388/2380" or "Imageon 2300" (If its even Imageon) , just need you guys to clarify this.
Just why I am making this thread - since Xperia is very versatile, like music/internet/messaging/videos with qwerty and etc. the only problem (for me), well, not as a problem, but as a shortage - gaming.
We have ScuMMM, sNes, sega, even PSX emu's, and maybe one game, who shows what Xperia is capable of - Xtrakt.
Since the most popular (because of its app store, games quantity) is iPhone,
And I must say iPhone games are really superb for a graphics aspect, imo best graphics in mobile phones/pda/smartphones field. (like Sims 3, NFS Undercover), I wonder if Xperia could do the same.
In GSM arena, I discovered that iPhone graphics chip is Powervr MBX-Lite (On iPhone & iPhone 3G), featuring OpenGL ES 1.1, OpenVG 1.0, Direct3D and of course full 2D/3D support, which, compared to "Imageon 2388/2380", is "almost" equal (dunno about Direct3D, although I think its not supported by Imageon) , so if any of you would tell whats the Xperia graphics chip, we would clarify the fact that we "could" enjoy the iPhone graphics (^^)
Not to tell about the WM gaming industry, which is ermm "....", but the fact, hope, that we could have this...
Now we have almost everything - itje, who dedicated very much to xda (his roms, other deeds are priceless) ((ofcourse his Touch-IT testing team, who not only answer touch-it related questions but is active like everyhwere)) other Rom and active app's/ xda contributors like gtrab, smaberg, jackleung,Tnyynt, fingerkeyboard makers, HTC encoder makers, other guys, fixing our phone bugs, creating soft for us,moderators... I could go on and on
naming these great people, who raised up our xperia from stock to almost perfection.
So only issue is...(for me ) gaming.
Heard that EA, gameloft are porting iPhone games to newer WM devices, but, I dont think that these sources are...well...realistic.
My target is to clarify Xperia graphics potential, know full information about graphics chip
P.S. Yes I've searched xda/google for this like crazy. Sorry for this thread to go as a poem.
P.S.S. Yes Xperia is business class phone, but hey, why not to dream? It still has got one of the best HW on WM devices around.
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Could you maybe find out by taking the x1 apart and looking at all of the chips? I looked at some videos online but couldnt see the names on any chips - not sure if it would even say but it seems as if it could work - i looked around a bit too and i keep hearing about the Imageon 2300 but i cant confirm it sorry
the ati part is not a chip it's intergrated into the qualcomm cpu
http://www.google.dk/search?source=ig&hl=da&rlz=&q=MSM7200a+ati&btnG=Google-søgning&aq=f&oq=
more info
Well its not the 2300, here a quote from ati "Imageon 2300 integrates an advanced 2D and 3D graphics engine, MPEG-4 video decoder, JPEG encoding/decoding, and a 2 Mega pixel camera sub-system processing engine. With support for up to 2MB of ultra low-power SDRAM, it "
link:http://ati.amd.com/products/imageon2300/
since we have (being said) 128 mb shared ram and ive also read some where in some sheet that we have an tuned up gpu. (this is all speculative tho)
and why do the touch pro have 288 and we 256 ram? do we have a better gpu needing more ram ?
Updated the post, please check, now only we need guys to compare both phones graphics capability.
Chaosstorm said:
Well its not the 2300, here a quote from ati "Imageon 2300 integrates an advanced 2D and 3D graphics engine, MPEG-4 video decoder, JPEG encoding/decoding, and a 2 Mega pixel camera sub-system processing engine. With support for up to 2MB of ultra low-power SDRAM, it "
link:http://ati.amd.com/products/imageon2300/
since we have (being said) 128 mb shared ram and ive also read some where in some sheet that we have an tuned up gpu. (this is all speculative tho)
and why do the touch pro have 288 and we 256 ram? do we have a better gpu needing more ram ?
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Seems like SE/HTC made some kind of adjustment with these GPU on xperia's MSM7200A, wondering what, so your guessing might be right about better xperia's gpu, or its just that touch pro's all interface/oem/os modifications are more "hungry" for ram.
Just for curiosity, new released iPhone 3GS has PowerVR SGX535 graphics, also SE iDou has same chip from SGX family (530 one), so we can expect awesome graphics, chip's techinical capabilities are very big:
# next generation fully programmable universal scalable shader architecture
# exceeding requirements of OpenGL 2.0 and up to DirectX 10.1 Shader Model 4.1
Just that 3GS's chip will be better than iDou's (535 - 28MPolys/s , 530 - 14 MPolys/s)
soo..... where can we find an D3D drivers for X1i?